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re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Sat Nov 24, 2012 06:10 PM
Thanks. I was reading about AA. I figure, if I can get him there, even if it's not the right one for him, I know that he is sincere for trying.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By ChristinePremium member Comments: 6815, member since Wed Feb 04, 2009
On Mon Nov 26, 2012 04:54 AM
Dream_chaser wrote:

I figure, if I can get him there, even if it's not the right one for him, I know that he is sincere for trying.


Sincerity, good intentions, are emotional. Action is more important. If you get him there, he isn't getting there himself. It is very common for women to believe it is up to them to help keep the alcoholic sober, but this comes from years and years of working at keeping the abnormal normal. As hard as it is for him to embrace the idea of sobriety, it will be equally hard for you to learn to step back and let him learn how to deal with his anxieties without drinking, on his own.

I don't like to bad mouth AA, because I know it does wonders for many people. I, however, am not a fan. In my life I've seen too many families where the sobriety of the alcoholic is as all consuming as the drinking was. Everything centers around the alcoholic. Of course it is better to be a sober alcoholic than an active drinker but isn't ever as easy as it looks. And it doesn't really look easy. It looks like it is dependent on a perfect balance of selfishness and selflessness. If the person working on sobriety has this balance withing themselves, wonderful. But if the dynamic is others selflessly give and understand and accommodate and adjust and forgive and the alcoholic still calls all the shots, can't cope with this or that so everyone has to tailor their choices, for example, it is still the selfish driving the wagon train.

I'm glad that your husband has succumbed to the pressure of his family of origin as well as his family of creation, however, if this doesn't come from him, from the inside, this is just going to be another cycle.

I know all counseling is expensive, but if you can find a way to manage to find someone to guide you through this...you, as an individual, regardless of any family counseling or Al Anon or whatever is involved with your husband's journey to sobriety, I would strongly recommend it. You are important and worthy of being allowed to do what is best for you.

More hugs.

Keep On Dancing*
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband (karma: 1)
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Mon Nov 26, 2012 03:56 PM
Thanks, Christine. I do understand all of this, I really do, but I also know that, for starters, I need to give a little. He IS trying and says, "I want to do this, myself, in my own way," but until he gives up the selfish ways of not caring how he affects others, it will only happen, again.

I don't care if it's AA, or other counseling, but he needs something. I am letting other family members, step in and backing off but I am also not against letting him know my feelings.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband (karma: 1)
By kandykanePremium member Comments: 16415, member since Mon May 01, 2006
On Mon Nov 26, 2012 04:29 PM
Stepping back was indeed a difficult task. I can't quite explain how I did it, either. But it's kind of an emotional disconnect. Of course, I still care about him and about what happens to him, but I cannot spend all day, everyday worrying about him. He has to take care of himself.

Selfish doesn't begin to touch what is going on with alcoholics. It's unbelievable just how self centered and uncaring of the effects they have on their loved ones they can be.

kk~
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Mon Nov 26, 2012 04:34 PM
That's for sure. If I could afford to leave today, I would. I could let him be alone and see how it feels, because I feel alone when I am with him.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Tue Nov 27, 2012 04:47 PM
Well, I said, "Talk to your boss," who is attending AA and did rehab. He did and he said he will attend a meeting. He thinks that they will somehow figure out that he is not an alcoholic and tell him that we are wrong. Oy.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By kandykanePremium member Comments: 16415, member since Mon May 01, 2006
On Tue Nov 27, 2012 05:08 PM
Oh, lord! How familiar. That denial is so strong, isn't it? Everybody knows but the alcoholic. Yeah... we're all wrong. :? It would be funny if it weren't so pitiful.

kk~
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By ChristinePremium member Comments: 6815, member since Wed Feb 04, 2009
On Tue Nov 27, 2012 05:42 PM
In my family, the alcoholics think it is, "Name Calling", if you use the word "alcoholic" when you take a step in faith and speak from the heart, offering love and support to help them shake the monkey on their backs. I have also been accused of being, "A Jesus Freak", when I suggest that there is a better way... a win/win way. The hilarious part of this is that I have NEVER discussed Jesus, Buddha, Socrates, or any other holy man or woman, or even "right and wrong" in relation to the drinking problem. I contain my pitch to the biology of the brain, the "real person inside" who we don't see when the drinker is drinking, and how much I need and miss that sober person. "You are a better person than this", is as harsh as I get. The pathetic reality is that alcoholics are booze junkies. There isn't anything a smack junkie won't do or think to maintain their habit. Unfortunately, the same is true for the legal smack in the bottle.

If I could afford to leave today, I would. I could let him be alone and see how it feels, because I feel alone when I am with him.


If I had a place of my own, I'd offer it to you, sadly, with the full knowledge that the reality would be that if he is like the people I know, he wouldn't even miss you. He'd use your absence as an excuse to drink more, and feel sorry for himself that you weren't washing the dishes as they accumulated around all the beer bottles. "Wa, wa. Nobody loves me...I'm all alone in the world. Even my old buddies Jim Beam and Jack Daniels are lying to me. Poor, poor me. No wonder I drink." There is no justice in this. For the sober, the problem is that sober brains work and think well. Unlike sodden brains. They will never agree with you, or see it your way. No win. (aside...my studio is always available to you to camp out in...honestly...)

KK - you hit the nail on the head about selfishness. There used to be a segment on an old tv show where they presented "words that aren't words but should be." I would love to invent a single word that covered the soul sucking delusional thinking and behavior of alcoholics. Summayah has a pet name for someone she works with..."Gidiot!" I bet we could come up with something as fitting, although it would be a bitter joke...we could at least smile about it.

Until then... I thank Dream_chaser, kk, and everyone else who is speaking so honestly and openly about a very painful subject most people are too ashamed to discuss. And really...how crazy is that?

Hugs to all

Keep On Dancing*
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By kandykanePremium member Comments: 16415, member since Mon May 01, 2006
On Tue Nov 27, 2012 06:25 PM
Yes, I've been accused of "disloyalty" for talking about it.

Another funny but not really funny thing - when they hide their drinking. All their little deceptive tricks... like we don't notice, even if we can't monitor the drinking. And then we point out that we know, just for the alcoholic to say "it was only one". Yeah, sure. A 50 oz ONE. And when I point out that his ONE drink is the same size as an entire bottle of wine, then come the excuses again. "Beer doesn't have as much alcohol as wine does." (Oh, but he conveniently omits that he had two shots of whiskey, also) And then follows the deal making.... "Can't I have just one on my day off? Or "can't I have a beer on New Year's Eve or my birthday or Sunday with the game? You can have one, why can't I?"

They way they talk is aimed at making the sober person feel stupid and confused and doubt what is right in front of us. That's the thing that is bothering me right now. Even though he's not drinking, the deceptive, side stepping, excuse making behavior is still going on. Mostly about his diet and smoking, now.

kk~
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband (karma: 1)
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Tue Nov 27, 2012 07:24 PM
I wanted to let you know that hubby is attending AA this Sat and again on Wed and even considering therapy. Thanks to his boss!
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By ChristinePremium member Comments: 6815, member since Wed Feb 04, 2009
On Tue Nov 27, 2012 07:40 PM
kandykane wrote:

Yes, I've been accused of "disloyalty" for talking about it.

Another funny but not really funny thing - when they hide their drinking. All their little deceptive tricks... like we don't notice, even if we can't monitor the drinking. And then we point out that we know, just for the alcoholic to say "it was only one". Yeah, sure. A 50 oz ONE. And when I point out that his ONE drink is the same size as an entire bottle of wine, then come the excuses again. "Beer doesn't have as much alcohol as wine does." (Oh, but he conveniently omits that he had two shots of whiskey, also) And then follows the deal making.... "Can't I have just one on my day off? Or "can't I have a beer on New Year's Eve or my birthday or Sunday with the game? You can have one, why can't I?"

They way they talk is aimed at making the sober person feel stupid and confused and doubt what is right in front of us. That's the thing that is bothering me right now. Even though he's not drinking, the deceptive, side stepping, excuse making behavior is still going on. Mostly about his diet and smoking, now.

kk~


^All of this. And truth be told, do we really need to chart the ounces to know that the person who used to live in that body is acting like a defensive, arrogant, ass? If they didn't act so awful, would we really care if they drank? It's just such an insult to your intelligence to have to "prove" that the other person is not at their best when drinking. If it's not booze doing this to the brain, then call an effin' ambulance because something is seriously disordered.

More hugs to all.

Keep On Dancing*
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Tue Nov 27, 2012 08:27 PM
Right. I have friends who know how to drink, socially, and even get tipsy, sometimes, but they don't abuse it. They don't need it. I can have a drink or two, and I am done. I never get the chance, though, since I am always the DD.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By kandykanePremium member Comments: 16415, member since Mon May 01, 2006
On Tue Nov 27, 2012 08:47 PM
It's just not even fun for me anymore to have a drink. If I do get to have one, I am home, usually alone. I am a real party pooper, likewise, because I am always the driver. And I've become extremely concious of others' drinking and driving. I don't like to be the party police, but if someone has had too much, I will speak up.

Our social life has suffered because he has embarrassed me in public too many times, so our social times in recent years are with family only. Consequently, most of the family thinks I am an old stick in the mud and he's the life of the party. Except the ones who recognize he has a problem.

kk~
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Wed Nov 28, 2012 02:22 AM
Many times, he embarassed me at my dance school, so I started not including him. We were not allowed back, at one school, for recital because, behind my back, while DJing (it was backstage) he had beer and it was not allowed on school grounds.

The next year, when I did not have him as DJ and wanted him just to come and watch his daughter dance, he did not come, until intermission, and had been drinking and started to cause a problem. I had to have two of the fathers take him away before my daughter, and others, saw what happened. She was upset that he did not watch her dance.

Whenever we did competitions, he would get drunk in the bar, so I stopped bringing him to them, too.

He did not make friends with anyone who did not drink and there were times when he drove drunk. He takes a long time to get drunk, so he can be quite the functional one. He never drank at work, at least not more than 2 beers at lunch, but once home, one after the other. How it did not affect his liver, I have no clue, but he looks 10 years older than his younger brother. I see a huge difference since last week, when he had his last beer, in his face.

Keeping fingers crossed.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By imadanseurPremium member Comments: 16604, member since Thu Dec 04, 2003
On Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:02 PM
In my life I've seen too many families where the sobriety of the alcoholic is as all consuming as the drinking was. Everything centers around the alcoholic.


But do you have an active family member actually in the program or do you just know from what you have seen? Since I know about the program and live it due to someone in my life being recovered for 10 years I couldn't disagree with this statement more, and know at least 50 other people (from going to meetings or functions with the person I am speaking of) and would say it isn't all consuming. They go to parties and functions with people drinking and nobody is freaking out that they might drink. AA has a much better success rate to keep people sober than people doing it on their own, and it keeps people alive. I can't dis a program where I have seen such amazing results.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Fri Nov 30, 2012 05:13 PM
If their life is around the recovering alcoholic, they are not doing the program for themselves, the right way. I do not intend to live my life to prevent him from doing it, again. That's up to him.

He will attend his first meeting, tomorrow. It will be 2 weeks, on Sunday, that he has not had a drink. The first 10 days, he only drank coffee, in the morning, and when his normal drinking started, he was drinking nothing.

I told him that he has to find a replacement or he will be dehydrated. He has bought some soda and chocolate milk, and normally, I would say it's not healthy, but in comparison to beer, it's a heck of a lot better.

He is a 100x better person to live with and even being kinder! I can't believe it. I just will pray that each day when I wake up, it continues.

I had some upsetting news, nothing tragic, about my job. They may have to close the dance program, as it's losing money. I was very upset and crying. He said (which he never would have before), "So what, you don't have a job. No big deal."

I said, "But you are not going to give me money. You whine when I ask for it."

He said, "That's my nature, but I won't not give you money." I almost fell over!!!

I thanked him. I said, "You have no idea what the means to me."

I am happy that his boss, who is his friend, too, is so supportive of him stopping and taking him to her meetings. I think that having a friend to voice your problems, is a HUGE help.

I am getting pressure from family to still get him to rehab, but I told them to back off. I said, "I can't make him do anything." If it does not come from him, it won't work."
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By d4jmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 12490, member since Fri Aug 27, 2004
On Fri Nov 30, 2012 05:29 PM
Steps forward - this is good news. There will be steps back too, but the road is now being traveled.

Hugs~
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By ChristinePremium member Comments: 6815, member since Wed Feb 04, 2009
On Sat Dec 01, 2012 06:56 AM
imadanseur wrote:

In my life I've seen too many families where the sobriety of the alcoholic is as all consuming as the drinking was. Everything centers around the alcoholic.


But do you have an active family member actually in the program or do you just know from what you have seen? Since I know about the program and live it due to someone in my life being recovered for 10 years I couldn't disagree with this statement more, and know at least 50 other people (from going to meetings or functions with the person I am speaking of) and would say it isn't all consuming. They go to parties and functions with people drinking and nobody is freaking out that they might drink. AA has a much better success rate to keep people sober than people doing it on their own, and it keeps people alive. I can't dis a program where I have seen such amazing results.


I'm sorry if I didn't make this POV clearer. It was certainly not my intention to dis AA or the results enjoyed by many, many people, with the success rate it has boasted for over 50 years. In fact, I have recommended AA to many people and may do so again should circumstances point in that direction.
The sentence that preceded the one quoted was
I don't like to bad mouth AA, because I know it does wonders for many people. I, however, am not a fan.


And no, personally... I am not a fan. I completely understand that alcoholism is a disease and a complicated one, at that. Like any disease of addiction the afflicted must be ever mindful of the triggers that can cause a relapse and if working a program helps them manage this, great. It is irresponsible for alcoholics to NOT address their illness or seek strategies to protect their health and families from the consequences of drinking. I feel the same way about support groups for diabetics, cancer, survivors of violence, and even those prone to violence...Parents Anonymous, for example.

However, for me, personally, I find the burden of building a life around alcoholism unfair and exhausting and just as the alcoholic has made choices based on their personal needs, I prefer to choose NOT to be yoked to this sub-culture. And believe it or not, I too "know at least 50 people" (mostly husbands,wives, children, or close family members of the alcoholics) who are not alcoholics but have had the quality of their own lives compromised by the choices of others, who share this opinion. I do agree that I have never known anyone who works the program, " go to parties and functions with people drinking freaking out that they might drink." For the first four or five years, we were all happy to do whatever it took to help the afflicted manage their illness. However, in order for us to "Get Off The Merry-Go-Round" (you may recognize this as a metaphor from a well used AA script)we had to move forward with our own lives and NOT make alcohol the center of our universe.

Diabetics need to constantly monitor their blood sugar levels, control their diet, and be vigilant about medical attention to protect themselves from the effects of their illness. It is appropriate for them to spend a good part of their daily allocation of time focusing on their diets, reading labels and recipes, and keeping up with the newest research. This too, for them, is lifesaving. There are lots of situations where individuals must put more into playing the hand they've been dealt in life than those more fortunate. However, it serves no useful purpose for me to spend hours of my week keeping up on the treatments and research regarding this particular disorder. It doesn't mean I am not compassionate, it doesn't mean anything other than I have my own demons to deal with and giving my time and emotion to this would be cheating my own needs and responsibilities. This is how I feel about a lifetime of Al-Annon...FOR ME....not as a "dis" to others who choose this strategy for dealing with life tangled up with an alcoholic.

But do you have an active family member actually in the program or do you just know from what you have seen?


^ I'm not sure what this means. One of the most important components of Alcoholics Anonymous is the anonymity . It would be impossible to "see" anything from the outside. All who participate in AA or its many spin off support groups, do so with the understanding that they are safe...that there is no judgement, that there is compassion and understanding, and no shame. I support this. And I support anyone's decision to choose this journey.

The only point I was making in my original statement, is that no one is required to make this choice if they aren't feeling it. After trying to be kind, fair, supportive, and understand for most of my life, I am now at the point where I can accept myself if I choose to NOT be a fan of a program that may help others, but sucks the life out of me.

Without revealing too many details, and violating the compact of anonymity, a very close family member who married an alcoholic and tried to work the associated programs for herself and her children, put it this way. "Alcoholics are selfish people. AA was founded by an alcoholic, a selfish person, to help other alcoholics, selfish people, stay sober. My mother was an alcoholic, my sister and brother are alcoholics, and my husband was an alcoholic. I'm sick of being required to live for the selfish." It may sound harsh to many, but honestly, she does have a point.

I think that what is important for me to clarify about my unpopular point of view about AA is that when the affected are in crisis, it may be a very successful solution. However, it is important for the non alcoholic know that if the structure of AA doesn't make their own life better, they don't have to embrace this life choice.

Keep On Dancing*
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband (karma: 1)
By kandykanePremium member Comments: 16415, member since Mon May 01, 2006
On Sat Dec 01, 2012 06:59 AM
Edited by kandykane (157761) on 2012-12-01 07:01:48
"Alcoholics are selfish people. AA was founded by an alcoholic, a selfish person, to help other alcoholics, selfish people, stay sober. My mother was an alcoholic, my sister and brother are alcoholics, and my husband was an alcoholic. I'm sick of being required to live for the selfish." It may sound harsh to many, but honestly, she does have a point.


O.M.G. YES! This. So this! So sick of this concept!!

Why must everything and every conversation, in person or on the phone consist of reporting how he has not had a drink and what he has done to fill his time instead of drinking and how the diet is going and how he feels and the doctor appointments and how it's hard but he can do it on his own, blah, blah, blah and then, perhaps as an after thought he might ask "how are things there?" By which point I am ready to say "fine" and just hang up. Because it is the same "me, me, MEEEE" thinking that led to this life of addiction and now this non-drinking addiction. And every person around me, too, asking "how is he doing?" Which is kind, but whatever happened to "How are you?"

Thanksgiving was a huge pain. He was in such a bad mood. Just having to change his habits in front of everyone. He's still hiding, you see. Doing all the changes in private is one thing but having the extended family witnessing it made him squirmy and grouchy and he took it out on me and his kids.

He also bought non-alcoholic beer which infuriated me and he couldn't understand why. It's because it's not really non-alcoholic. That's just a legal interpretation, not a medical definition. It contains 0.5% alcohol. Which is STILL alcohol!! For his heart and his alcoholism, I just think that it's a horrendously bad idea!

kk~
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Sat Dec 01, 2012 03:46 PM
I was supposed to attend my first Al Anon meeting on Thursday but did not sleep well the night before and passed out, early, missing it. So, I found another one and feel that I was meant to be at this particular meeting, as the group dynamics was wonderful. In one night, I realized how much I need to work on ME. Talk about a kick in the pants, a slap upside the head, and being forced (by me) to look well into the mirror at my own self and actions. I will go, again.

I have to say, seeing the above posts, that the meeting was NOT about the alcoholic and we are not to be focused on them, at all. It was all about me and what I need to do for me.

It's the idea that if we work on us, it can only help us, and if it overflows onto the alcoholic, so be it.

We can't live in a bubble, either. What we do affects all around us, good and bad. I know many, recovering alcoholics, and so many are not really selfish, and ones who were, have stopped. Not all, some still are, but I can't label all alcoholics in the same way, as I can't call all Italians mafia, Etc.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband (karma: 2)
By maureensiobhan Comments: 4726, member since Wed Dec 24, 2003
On Sat Dec 01, 2012 12:12 PM
Edited by maureensiobhan (80481) on 2012-12-01 12:15:46 fixed quote
Edited by maureensiobhan (80481) on 2012-12-01 12:18:03 tried again to fix quote
{q] Alcoholism is a disease

I completely disagree with this. Sure, alcoholism can cause many true diseases such as cirrhosis of the liver, liver cancer, stomach cancer, oral cancer, and/or esophagial cancer. I just don't, however, see alcholism itself as a disease, but rather as an addiction.

By the way, I have seen family members who have been and stil are major alcoholics. My brother has for many years been a major alcoholic, to the point where the doctor at rehab said to him, "It's a wonder your liver is still functioning.". He's lost I think three jobs, and has driven non-alcoholic friends away as a result of his drinking. His friends and all of us in the family have backed off and left it up to him to take responsibility for himself to get his own life into some semblence of order. After twenty years, his ex-wife, whom I still call my sister-in-law, finally got up the courage to kick him out. She's managed to build a better life for herself since then. She told us once that it's a shame that it took her twenty years to take action for herself. He's still continued to drink, though, because he still can't handle, after nearly 16 years, that she kicked him to the curb. So, here's an example of his playing the blame game as an excuse to continue drinking.

More virtual hugs, Dream_Chaser. Know that we're all here pulling for you.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:27 PM
Thank you, Maureen. I can't say if it is or is not a disease and I am sure it will always be under scrutiny. I was reading this... alcoholism.about.com . . .. Intersting.

All I know is that since he stopped, for 2 weeks, it's like living with a new husband. I will be thankful for anything that makes life more pleasant.

I am just angry with myself for allowing my kids to grow up with it. He was not a horrible drunk, like some, but still, talking to my daughter, I am sorry I did not do something back then. I can't change that, though, so I will not hang onto it.

You all have no clue how much your support means to me. I wish I could hug you all, in real life.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By imadanseurPremium member Comments: 16604, member since Thu Dec 04, 2003
On Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:06 AM
Maureen, you may not think it is a disease, but most medical professionals and psychologists (which I don't think you are), agree that it is.

Alcoholism is a chemical disease because alcohol breaks down differently in the stomach and has a completely different effect on the brain on an alcoholic compared to a non-alcoholic. It is biological in the sense that the chemical predisposition is inherited. Identical twin studies that have been repeated many times (that I studied in college when getting my psych minor) show that identical twins separated at birth will tend to both be alcoholic or non-alcoholic regardless of their environmental upbringing.

It's primary since it isn't the cause of another disease. It's gotten its own diagnosis and pathology. And even thought it isn't dependent on another disease to be present it is the catalyst of others...as previously mentioned.

It's progressive - getting worse over a period of time. Doctors can predict with great accuracy the symptoms of this progressive disease, and the effects it will have when untreated.

Alcoholism is chronic, thus why people have to stay sober and cannot drink in moderation like normal people.

Alcoholism is fatal because an alcoholic's life expectancy is about 13 years shorter than the average person.

Addicts may be very selfish, but I don't find people in recovery that way. I know people in the program who were Hospice volunteers and helped when my dad was in the hospital, people helped us move, one AA group in Phoenix have formed a separate Habitat for Humanity group, another guy I know is now a pastor and takes the AA program into state prisons in my state. I just don't know how you can label millions upon millions of recovering addicts as selfish.

Why must everything and every conversation, in person or on the phone consist of reporting how he has not had a drink and what he has done to fill his time instead of drinking and how the diet is going and how he feels and the doctor appointments and how it's hard but he can do it on his own, blah, blah, blah and then, perhaps as an after thought he might ask "how are things there?" By which point I am ready to say "fine" and just hang up. Because it is the same "me, me, MEEEE" thinking that led to this life of addiction and now this non-drinking addiction. And every person around me, too, asking "how is he doing?" Which is kind, but whatever happened to "How are you?"


So why don't you just say, "I'm kind of hurt that you don't ask about me." or "Can I tell you how I am doing first?" People don't always know what you want or need. If you just tell them, it might remove the resentment. We think people should just know this kind of stuff, but they aren't mind readers. They are concerned, and at least they are calling.

Okay, sorry for the hijack Dream Chaser. I really really really hope you continue to see forward movement during this holiday season. It can be the toughest for some recovering alcoholics but you seem like you have lots of support and love all around.
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By Dream_chaserPremium member Comments: 25854, member since Thu Jul 26, 2001
On Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:22 AM
Hijack away! This should be informative, too.

It's true about asking. I am learning, from my on line Al Anon group, and from my first meeting, that we can't assume anyone knows how we feel. We have to be vocal.

I am learning to say, "I feel bad when you.." or "I like it when you..." or "I don't like it when you..." or "I need help with..." because we may assume that they know and because we know it, we assume that they know it, but they are not we!
re: At odds at what to do with alcoholic husband
By kandykanePremium member Comments: 16415, member since Mon May 01, 2006
On Sun Dec 02, 2012 05:19 AM
So why don't you just say, "I'm kind of hurt that you don't ask about me." or "Can I tell you how I am doing first?" People don't always know what you want or need. If you just tell them, it might remove the resentment. We think people should just know this kind of stuff, but they aren't mind readers. They are concerned, and at least they are calling.


What makes you think I have not done so? Of course I have! Multiple times. When I have said as much to him that it would be nice if he thought of others or asked about his kids first, he gets defensive and says "well, why don't you ask about me?" Me, me, meeee! He is calling because he is scared for his health. He almost died a few weeks ago from heart disease brought on by alcohol abuse. He is trying to fill the time he ordinarily would spend drinking. It is a crutch. He never called before he quit. Or rarely, anyway. Because he knew (that one took a long time for him to get, too) I did not want a drunken phone call. And I could tell when he'd been drinking, even on the phone.

Also, I don't feel it should be necessary to say something every. Single. Time. Day in and day out. And truthfully, I'm not really hurt anymore. Just annoyed. The song and dance routine gets old.

It's also interesting that some think an alcoholic would actually LISTEN to their family. We've already gone over that - they are the last to know they have a problem, the first to deny, the first to place blame on others. He's not going to say "oh, I'm sorry, how thoughtless of me."

He is manifesting his alcoholism in a non-drinking manner, if that makes sense. Yes, he is not drinking, right now. But he has not getten any help for the issues behind the drinking. The focus is still on him and his alcoholism.

kk~
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