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Discrepency on Wings
By tiptaptam
On Tue Jul 27, 2004 03:31 PM
Edited by tiptaptam (87291) on 2004-07-27 15:32:47

I have been tapping for 9 years, but only took classes intensively for about 3 (at the start). Other than that it has been workshops....random classes in NY.... and tapping all the time on my own. I teach tap now.... and I have a question about wings. I was taught to do them at the Barre... that they are three sounds... SCRAPE the side of your tap out and come in similar to skipping a stone.... HIT STEP. I have always been succesfull with this...can do one footed and switching wings, with clear sounds....

Recently I was told that it is incorrect and that there should be absolutely NO touching of the foot on the way out.
I am thinking that this may be a version of a wing... but this person is positive that it is absolutely wrong to make three sounds. What is the case.... and if it is just a style thing...what style doesn't scrape out.

28 Replies to Discrepency on Wings

re: Discrepency on Wings
By txtapster
On Tue Jul 27, 2004 04:20 PM
I learned w/ a scrape as well. I am sure there are many different ways to do a wing but what you are doing is not wrong. Just a different method. I have been dancing for 20 yrs and teaching for 8 and that is the way I have always done them and have been successful. Keep doing what you believe. There is never one way to do something.

Keep tappin'
re: Discrepency on Wings
By JazzyTapper64member has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Tue Jul 27, 2004 07:35 PM
Though I've only been tapping for a few years (though I am at the highest level at my studio, so I'm not a complete beginner or anything), I have been taught wings from 3 different teachers, and all three have taught it with a scrape, so while with a scrape may be a variation, I doubt that doing it that way is downwright wrong, as all the posters in this thread (including myself)have been taught that way.
re: Discrepency on Wings
By glitterfairyPremium member
On Tue Jul 27, 2004 08:02 PM
I've been tapping for over 10 years now, and in all the syllabi I know and all the tappers I've ever come across, a wing is defined by three sounds- the initial "wing" out of the foot, and the brush back in (2 beats, 3 beats in total)

Throughout the years there have been many cheat methods to achieve wings- some fudge by doing a brush out on the ball of the foot, without sickling the foot at all. Similarly, many people miss the first beat altogether.

I would question the basis for such beliefs - that there are only 2 sounds. Generally in tap, the aim is to make a sound. If you can't make a sound whilst taking a foot out, you're only left with the "brush back" sound, which is technically only a pickup, or pullback, for the American counterparts. Perhaps there is a case of terminology differences (although how anyone could mistake a wing for anything else is beyond me) or an incomplete tap education?

Best wishes!
By tiptaptam
On Wed Jul 28, 2004 06:42 AM
Thanks for all your input. With how confident she seemed all around... I thought for sure I would end up wrong here.

I did question her on it.... and she brought up competition tapping.... and said that if there is any scrape...that there would be deductions.
I have never been involved in competition dance, hence, I couldn't disagree with this... and thought maybe it was a style thing.

Anyway.... Thank you, I will stick to my guns!
wing Discrepency
By ChicaEnPointe
On Wed Jul 28, 2004 01:00 PM
I am studying for my BATD Stage associate right now and I have always learned a wing with a brush outwards. This made me curious so i grabbed my tap technique book and it has wing preparation as : Push ball of working foot sidwards along the ground and lift, tap ball inwards and replace foot on ball. I take this as an outward brush so i would say that you sound right!
By tiptaptam
On Wed Jul 28, 2004 02:43 PM
What is the name of that book, where can I find it? That would help me a lot, just as a reference. I like to make sure I am doing things right.
re: Discrepency on Wings
By glitterfairyPremium member
On Thu Jul 29, 2004 02:00 AM
Excellent. So, has she had any FORMAL tap education? Competition can be wonderful, and I love it, but often technical things like this can slide because it's something you havwe to listen for and adjudicators often can't hear much over the music.

I've been competing for several years now - 4 at major (ie State/National) level and we would all get out heads chopped off if we missed a single beat- including wings!

Look at it logically. If we just wanted two beats, we would hop on one foot twice. Since there's an outward action involved, why the heck would anyone want to do that unless we made a sound?!?!

Best wishes!
RE: Wow
By icurnvs2m8
On Sun Aug 01, 2004 06:00 AM
OK, I understand your confusion and it is rightly so but your friend may be slightly confused herself. A basic wing has 3 beats (sounds) but there are also 4 and 5 beat wings.

I have seen a 2 beat step similar to a wing but I wouldn't call it a wing. It is where you hop in the air, as you hop you hit the ground and then land (I call it a nerve beat hop).

When it comes to wings it is a scraping action but with proper technique it should be only a small scrape (like an inch at longest), it shouldn't sound like a long scrape. A long scraping wing isn't clear and doesn't sound correct inside the beat, all sounds are of the same length &a1. A longer scrape also means that it looks different as you are moving your legs further apart to get the sound out, I believe doing that is harder to get your legs back together and you waste leg energy. Plus there is only the SLIGHTEST sickling of the foot.

When it comes to competitions judges are listening to clarity, light and shade, and performance value. A judge is also judging on their personal opinion, and degrees of understanding they have of good technique.

I also have come to understand that some students think that a pick up is done with a scraping sound pulling backwards, it hits not scrapes and lifted up if it scraped back it would be called a pick scuffback.

It's late at night for me, and my mind has been on this and the television so I hope this is understand-able.
Thank You
By tiptaptam
On Mon Aug 02, 2004 11:08 AM
Thank you all,
From the looks of it, my training was good, and I have no reason to have doubted it. Thank you,

re: Discrepency on Wings
By satapper
On Thu Aug 05, 2004 12:41 AM
yeah youve got nothing to worry about we just recently got the new AIDT exams and revision and a wing is defined as a scrapping of the foot out and brush in and step so ya and in competitions (world champs) they do look for technique but most of the time the steps are done so quickly that in a wing you wouldnt really notice the difference in footwork but then they would listen to the sounds. Plus you get marked on 3 catagories
1. Technique 2. choreography 3. style and presentation
anyway enjoy
I agree
By funkytap
On Wed Aug 11, 2004 11:56 PM
I agree with NVS above.

also there is a new wing being performed in the USA. I saw it on a recent trip to the NY tap dance festival.

its a six -beat wing (thats right 6!) on one foot. Described best as

"scrape foot out, backward hit, forward hit, (like a reverse shuffle), tap step in, heel drop."

thats right - also on one foot - i cant do it for the life of me!!!

try that my friends!
re: Discrepency on Wings
By tiptaptam
On Tue Aug 17, 2004 03:20 PM
Thank you again.
I tried a "double" wing once (five sounds). I don't remember why I gave up on it.... I just remeber that short of putting all my wait on a ballet was NOT happening.
I like my ankles.... and I think I must have decided to leave it for a couple of years.
Maybe I will try it again.
re: Discrepency on Wings
By ash1488
On Sun Sep 12, 2004 01:00 PM
i learned with a scrape out, but everyone taps alittle diffrent.
discrep on wings
By d_ance
On Fri Sep 24, 2004 04:37 AM
ive been doing wings for at lest 3 years now and have been exmined on them multiple times. i do my examsthrough the commonwealth dance association. (i live in australia) altho when u are taught wings it looks like a 'scrape' when u do do a wng it is not. your foot does not scrape along its side at all.

a wing is rotating the foot out and a quik hit with the ball of your foot. u do twist your ankle into a scrapping motion bu dont actualli scrape your foot, you hit with it.

hope i helped a little.
re: Discrepency on Wings
By tiptaptam
On Wed Sep 29, 2004 09:24 AM
See, now that is what this girl was telling me. It must just be a different style.....I have recently bought three different books....all of which say 3 sounds....the first being a scape out.

Maybe this is old fashion....but tap is a little old I guess I will stick with what I am doing....but keep an open mind about new stuff.
re: Discrepency on Wings
By imadanseurPremium member
On Fri Oct 01, 2004 12:21 AM
It is a scrape! Go to the history of tap book...ask any hoofer, it is a scrape. You have to sickle your ankle slightly when you start a wing. This is how Gregory Hines taught my teacher, and he had generations of hoofers teaching him. It may be old fashioned, but it's the correct way to teach them.
Double Wings???
By suzryan
On Mon Oct 04, 2004 10:53 AM
I only know one wing type (yes it has a small scrape). How do you do double (or any other type of wings)????
re: Discrepency on Wings
By FabulousFeet
On Sun Oct 10, 2004 12:50 AM
I've been tapping for 12 years and I always learned the scrape, but thats not to say that there is a version that I don't know.
Former Rockette/ 18 yrs. experience
By shimmybridget
On Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:15 AM
Hi, don't worry you are right and she is not. You must make at least 3 sounds for it to be considered a wing. The judges will actually deduct points if they don't hear all three sounds, I know this b/c it's happened to my students. If you do a jump for a prep then there is four sounds, then there can be a 5 sound wing which is brush out, brush in, flap out or you can reverse it and go brush in, brush out, and flap in. Pendillum wings a single wing with the other foot brushing front, back wards wings, front wings, quad. wings. Tell her this or at competition she'll get a very rude awakening.
re: Discrepency on Wings
By xoxoAnnettexoxo
On Sun Oct 17, 2004 09:30 AM
I learned it with a scrape.
re: Discrepency on Wings
By pink_dance_baby3
On Tue Oct 19, 2004 12:33 AM
I learnt it with a scrape. ive been learning under the BAL syllabus so i think that was just one type of wing!
re: Discrepency on Wings
By Dancing_feet00
On Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:22 PM
i learnt with a scrape and got wings in less than a year , they are so fun to do, now im doing the 5 sound wings. they sound really cool
re: Discrepency on Wings
By specialballerina
On Wed Dec 08, 2004 07:33 PM
Yes, I learn the BAL syllabus. we do wings exctly the way you described. I recently did my exams and I am sure there is no change for wings, even in other syllabus.
re: Discrepency on Wings
By j11kat
On Wed Dec 15, 2004 06:28 PM
There is definitely a scrape on the way out!!
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