Forum: Arts / Philosophy

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re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By CheesePlusCakemember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Sat Apr 09, 2005 12:31 PM
In the Catholic church we are taught that homosexuality is NOT a choice and that homosexuals should be respected and treated like anyone else. It stated right in my catechism and Catholic morality books when I went to Catholic school last year that it wasn't a choice.


Yea, we do believe that homosexual sex is wrong (and I really don't feel like hearing the whole "So we're expected to love each other and such but not express it via sex?" thing again), but I believe it makes more sense because homosexual acts are condemned in the Bible but homosexuals are not.


I'm not saying homosexual acts are wrong or right, and I'm not saying I believe they're wrong or right; I'm stating what the Catholic church believes and teaches.
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By mr_weird_guy
On Mon Apr 11, 2005 11:34 PM
It is good teachings, but unfortunately they are fairly recent, and there is a whole mass of people who haven't actually heard those words, and believe in condemnation. Sad really. Hopefully there will be more reforms in the teachings of the church...

later dayz
J
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By Napolimember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Tue Apr 12, 2005 11:24 AM
I am Christian and I have stayed out of these debates sofar. I am straight but that doesn't stop me from making friends with gey people we are all humans you know. I believe God gave averybody free will for a reason.

I don't know if anyone has posted direct quotes from the Bible about homosexuality but I will just to prove there are some. But remember, the Bible was written by a lot of different people a long time ago and translated a bunch of times so everything in there is not always accurate.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 (NIV): "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters, nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God."

Leviticus 18:22 (KJV): "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind it is abomination."

It also says in the Bible "Don't condemn others and God won't condemn you."
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By RedheadGredmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Tue Apr 12, 2005 09:27 PM
Well I am a big gay rights activist. I of course think it is right. Tomorrow I am doing the national day of silence. I will be wearing a pink shirt(I hate pink) that on the front says What will you do to end the silence? Then on the back in an upside down triangle it says Gay Straight Alliance. Then inside of the triangle it says Day of Silence. I am doing this because I strongly believe that people who are homosexual should have the same rights and should be treated equally and not silenced.

I have in my GSA folder such an amazing article that I completely agree with. I will scan it and post it on here when I am not half asleep.Good night everyone. I am not going on the internet again until the day of silence is over. Even the internet counts as communication.
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By Sky_Dancer
On Wed Apr 13, 2005 12:39 PM
I don't understand why in this day in age it is still such a big issue.I believe in god, but to me the bible is kinda iffy, while it is the word of god it was written by man and we all know that man is not without faults.
I think that anyone who uses the bible as an excuse always uses it to say "well god says it's wrong" The bible also says let he who is without sin cast the first stone, so how does anyone have the right to judge someone based on wether or not their gay. I mean I don't know about the rest of you but I'm not without sin so I have no right to judge anyone (Even though I don't think that they should be judged.)
Also why doesn't everyone who thinks that being gay is wrong have a post about how wrong it is to sleep with everyone. God said that, that was wrong to. You might as well say stone all of the "hoes".
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By Hazel
On Wed Apr 13, 2005 11:27 PM
erm... Napoli... click back a couple of pages, hun, we already disputed the authenticity of the word "homosexual" in the Bible.
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right? (karma: 4)
By PolkaDotmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Fri Apr 15, 2005 09:54 PM
If god didn't want people to be gay, then why are there gay people? Oh and another thing, people say that we are all a part of god. If we are all a part of god, and some people are gay and they came from god..wouldn't that make god bisexual?
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right? (karma: 2)
By born2preformmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Mon Apr 18, 2005 10:08 AM
I feel people have the right to be whatever they want. I am not saying that I am 100% with gays I'm just saying other people shouldn't care if they are. My mother is going to a Fashion Design School in Boston and she is surrounded by gays almost everyday. Before her experience in school she hated gays and thought of them as sinners, since that is what the Bible said. Now she sees they are regular people and there is not much of a difference exept who they might be dating. I think the Bible is extremely important but we need to open our minds about gays. But thats just what I think. :)
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By from_lornasmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Sun May 08, 2005 12:13 PM
I know this is kinda dead, but I have another point to add..


Love should not be so shallow as to what's on the outside. It's deeper than that.
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By Zynthia
On Mon May 09, 2005 11:16 PM
I don't agree with it. And I understood its hard and many people fall under these temptations but they should definetely try their hardest. They are also called to live in God's grace. But it is already hard enough for them so we should all be able to treat them with respect and compassion.
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By DefyingGravityPremium member
On Mon May 09, 2005 11:59 PM
<i>many people fall under these temptations</i>

You mean the temptations of being horny? O god forbid people love each other and have sex...
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By from_lornasmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Tue May 10, 2005 08:14 AM
many people fall under these temptations


So loving somebody because of who they are, not what sex organ they have is a temptation?
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right? (karma: 2)
By Cindy3
On Tue May 10, 2005 09:00 AM
I have two feelings, one biblical and the other personal.

There are lots of things against it in the Old Testament. But I believe in Christ, and I don't think he dissed gays or lesbians as far as I know. I cannot think of him saying bad things about them at all. His love and acceptance knew no bounds, from what I can tell.

Second, personal. The ballet company I danced in in Ohio wanted to do Coppelia, so we brought in the artistic director of a really big ballet company, and he set the entire thing, all acts, all roles, in one long long afternoon. It all came from his head! He was gay, but for the first time in my life, I judged a gay as a person, not what moral standard I have. And I called him Sir.

Another time I went visiting in Chicago, and danced at a dance club that had a wild, nutty multicultural and, as it turned out, multi sexual orientational clientele. I saw out of the corner of my eye two guys, holding each other in the most tenderand loving way. Right that moment, I thought, what right have I to judge them. They found happiness, and they are lucky. Even though their kind of orientation is not my kind, in my mind it is all OK.

Live and let live, and accept but do not judge, that is what I truly believe.
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right? (karma: 4)
By Lavendarmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Tue May 10, 2005 06:40 PM
Zynthia, I don't think anyone who is homosexual wants your sympathy *rolls eyes*

Jeez lou.
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By Hazel
On Tue May 10, 2005 06:43 PM
Cindy, that was wonderful. I'm honestly amazed at your strength as a person.

Zynthia, try to refrain from being too condescending. There are definitely GLBT people here, and I know they will NOT appreciate you treating their lives as "mistakes".
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By Brittanymember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Tue May 10, 2005 07:15 PM
And I understood its hard and many people fall under these temptations but they should definetely try their hardest.


Why? Why should I try to stay away from females in a relationship way? It's who I am attracted to. I can't help that. I am not going to live my life denying that I like females. Yeah, I like guys too, but I like females. If I found a female I fell in love with, I am not going to stay away from the "temptation"
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right? (karma: 5)
By NadiaLadidamember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Tue May 10, 2005 09:27 PM
News Flash!

Gay Men Respond Differently to Pheromones
May 10, 2005 1:46 PM EDT


WASHINGTON - The sexual area of a gay man's brain works a lot like that of a woman when exposed to a particular stimulus, researchers say.

In an experiment, men and heterosexual women sniffed a chemical from the male hormone testosterone. The homosexual men's brains responded differently from those of heterosexual males, and in a similar way to the women's brains.

"It is one more piece of evidence ... that is showing that sexual orientation is not all learned," said Sandra Witelson, an expert on brain anatomy and sexual orientation at the Michael G. DeGroote School of Medicine at McMaster University in Ontario, Canada.

Witelson, who was not part of the research team, said the findings clearly show a biological involvement in sexual orientation.

The study, published in Tuesday's issue of Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, was done by researchers at the Karolinska Institute in Stockholm, Sweden.

They exposed heterosexual men and women and homosexual men to chemicals derived from male and female sex hormones. These chemicals are thought to be pheromones - molecules known to trigger responses such as defense and sex in many animals.

Whether humans respond to pheromones has been debated, although in 2000 American researchers reported finding a gene that they believe directs a human pheromone receptor in the nose.

The brains of different groups responded similarly to ordinary odors such as lavender, but differed in their response to the chemicals thought to be pheromones, lead researcher Ivanka Savic said.

The Swedish researchers divided 36 subjects into three groups - heterosexual men, heterosexual women and homosexual men. They studied the brain response to sniffing the chemicals, using PET scans. All the subjects were healthy, unmedicated, right-handed and HIV-negative.

When they sniffed scents like cedar or lavender, all of the subjects' brains reacted only in the olfactory region that handles smells.

But when confronted by a chemical from testosterone, the male hormone, portions of the brains active in sexual activity were activated in straight women and in gay men, but not in straight men, the researchers found.

The response in gay men and straight women was concentrated in the hypothalamus with a maximum in the preoptic area that is active in hormonal and sensory responses necessary for sexual behavior, the researchers said.

When the female hormone estrogen was used, there was only a response in the olfactory portion of the brains of straight women. Homosexual men had their primary response also in the olfactory area, with a very small reaction in the hypothalamus, while heterosexual men responded strongly in the reproductive region of the brain.

Savic said the group is also doing a study involving homosexual women, but those results are not yet complete.

In a separate study looking at response to body odors, researchers in Philadelphia found sharp differences between gay and straight men and women.

"Our findings support the contention that gender preference has a biological component that is reflected in both the production of different body odors and in the perception of and response to body odors," said neuroscientist Charles Wysocki, who led the study.

It's hard to see how a simple choice to be gay or lesbian would influence the production of body odor, he said.

Wysocki's team at the Monell Chemical Senses Center studied the response of 82 heterosexual and homosexual men and heterosexual and homosexual women to the odors of underarm sweat collected from 24 donors of varied gender and sexual orientation.

They found that gay men differed from heterosexual men and women and from lesbian women, both in terms of which body odors gay men preferred and how their own body odors were regarded by the other groups.

Gay men preferred odors from gay men, while odors from gay men were the least preferred by heterosexual men and women and by lesbian women in the study. Their findings, released Monday, are to be published in the journal Psychological Science in September.

The Swedish research was funded by the Swedish Medical Research Council, the Karolinska Institute and the Magnus Bergvall Foundation. Wysocki's research was supported by the Monell Center.

---

On the Net:

Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences: www.pnas.org

Karolinska Institute: info.ki.se . . .

Monell Center: www.monell.org
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right? (karma: 2)
By Ayamember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Thu May 12, 2005 12:04 AM
Zynthia, I pity you. I don't want your condescending pity and "help" because I happen to be bi; it is something that I am comfortable with, and it has led me to the love of my life. I do, however, pity you for being an obnoxious homophobe.
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By Louisemember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Thu May 12, 2005 04:56 AM
<I>And I understood its hard and many people fall under these temptations but they should definetely try their hardest.</i>

Why?

Louise
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right? (karma: 1)
By mr_weird_guy
On Thu May 12, 2005 11:47 AM
The only temptations that there are are premarital sex (seeing as same sex marriage is such a big debate right now), and that is only if you prescribe to the Christian beliefs that proclaim this notion. Honestly, at this point in my life, pity for my sexuality is not what I need.

later dayz
J

ps - love the article! I love how this is going to get into a big science vs. religion thing!!
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By Naoisemember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Fri May 20, 2005 09:57 AM
~*sigh*~
even as i write this, i'm considering not sending it. i'm really emotional right now, so maybe this is not the best time for this. I got a rude awakening this morning by my girlfriend calling to tell me that one of our good friends is in trouble with the military over a woman she was seeing (in case you don't know, the military frowns upon the whole gay thing)and having not listened to me about what to do if questioned, she has done some really dumb things. sooo...i have been on the phone trying to get her contact info for the servicemembers legal defense network can help her...but i fear it's too late.

perfect lead-in to this topic, i think...we are debating whether or not gay is good, right?

now, i will never claim to have read the bible and i think that there are enough people posting here that have so i'm not worried about that. what i am worried about is my future and the future of those like me. i am so sad that people have to ask this question. at first, i thought i was mad...and maybe i am, but right now, i'm just sad. until 3 years ago i lived my life as a straight woman. engaged and all...and then i met kris and realized the emptiness i could never figure out was that i was waiting for her to come along. i left my fiance and have been with kris for 3 years. we are getting married next year and we are starting the artifical insemination this fall. i admit, i flamed a bit when i first came out. i grew up 30 mins away from the national's capitol, so things were pretty progressive there. it never occured to me that someone might have a problem with me being gay. until my dad pulled me aside and told we he worried that someone would see the billion gay stickers on my car and want to kill me. since then, the flames have gone down...i've marched in parades, organized groups...but something still bothers me...

people honestly think that i'm wrong. i can't even read/watch the news now a days without seeing someone bashing my lifestyle. oh man, especially here...i just moved to spokane 2 months ago...you may have heard about spokane...our mayor has made it the laughing stock of all cities right now. he is an anti-gay mayor who just happens to like to offer gay men jobs for sex on gay.com. score one for the gays! i'm lucky enough to work for a company that doesn't discriminate against gays and has a domestic partnership, but a lot of others aren't..for instance my girlfriend...who is willing to fight for her country..but at the price of lying about her life.

i wasn't going to post on this thread, or even read it...but i knew i had friends on here that would be posting and wanted to see what they would be saying...hi ali...and i think over all you guys have done a great job...i know how angry you must be...and even the "gays are sinners" people are not making me wanna strangle them. the poster is a little off, if you ask me, but what can you do?

have i answered the question yet? no? do i think it's right? of course...i even *gasp* think it's natural

where are we headed guys? i mean really? will they ever except us for who we are? will we forever be the lepers, the criminals, the sinners? let me ask you...with benefits this bad, who in their right mind would choose to be gay? i'm trying really hard not to say "can't we all just get along?" because i know we can't..and i know that this topic will be beat into the ground again and again...but it hurts so bad...it's depressing...i hate this...but you know what? if i had the choice (which i don't, thank you very much, unless i don't want to be true to myself) i'd pick the way my girl makes me feel about myself and our life together any day.

i'm sure that when i read over this, it'll make my head hurt from being so confusing and i apologize to anyone who's head is about to explode...aspirin on me...

nisha
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right? (karma: 4)
By DejaDerangemember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Fri May 20, 2005 07:43 PM
Ohh, I'm tempted by girls!! I'm such a pathetic person, I need your piiiity!! Pardon my french, but cut the c***! We don't need you being condescending. Honestly, if you feel so sorry for us... why not try being nice and understanding? Or accepting, perchance? Would you pity someone just because they were black? "Oh, I'm so sorry, for those people have been tempted into having dark skin!" I see no difference, except that homosexuality is inside and being black is outside. Both traits are acquired by simply being BORN. There is no temptation, except to do things before marriage. And guess what? Some of us aren't going to!!

Honestly, if Adam and Eve (or Adam and Steve, you never know ;) ) could taste the forbidden fruit, why can't I taste the forbidden fruit that is a girl? I did, after all come from them, and apparently from God as well. If god hates me oh so much for all my sin, why doesn't he just strike me down with a jolt of lightning or a heart attack as I type this? Because he doesn't mind!!

Any hypothetical God will love all his children-- do you know any parent that doesn't love their child? Sure, he might be upset because we don't follow that little book, but he would still love us anyway.

If he can't find it in his heart to love us for who we are... Why the heck would you want to follow him? I mean, if he's so unaccepting that anything less than what he wants isn't accepted, then why would you want to be so loving him?

Why would you choose that path that is so hateful to all but the select few?

This quote has been used before, but its pertainent--

"I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians, for they are so unlike your Christ" --Ghandi.


Believe it or not, some of us think Jesus was a pretty cool guy. According to the Bible, he went around being genarally nice to people and such. He sacrificed himself for his cause, too, which is a very wonderful thing to do. You Christians, though, are so unlike him. I doubt that it would ever even occur to Jesus to be condescending like that or to tell people that they are completely wrong ant that that makes them bad people. He would probably just try to get them to accept god anyway. Well, rather than try to convert us, you're just mocking us, and frankly... You're a bad person for doing so. Didn't you learn in kindergarten to play nicely with the other children?

To use my favorite phrase... "For shame!"

M
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By luvNdancermember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Sat May 21, 2005 01:44 AM
yes, I do belive its right.
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?
By from_lornasmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Sat May 21, 2005 07:48 PM
You Christians, though, are so unlike him.

Apparently I'm Christian (I'm still looking about, but I'm mainly Christian), and I don't doubt that I am unlike him. Hell, I think everybody is. But, I didn't like how yous said, "you Christians" as if we're terrible people, and all the same, it seemed very stereotypical, but I know you didn't mean it that way. Karma for all your good points, and comedial phrases. :)

And, so I'm not totally hijacking this thread,
Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right?


I believe it's not necessarily a question of "thinking" it's right, it IS right. Whether you know or not.

Haha.
-Lana
re: Gay or Lesbian....Do you think it's right? (karma: 1)
By NeoSoulchildmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Sat May 21, 2005 07:56 PM
Edited by tooty1981 (117377) on 2005-05-21 19:58:20 a correction in spelling...
Edited by tooty1981 (117377) on 2005-05-21 20:01:50 wanted to take out an unnecessary comment...
I understand what you're trying to say, Stagebrat, but don't you think your statement was contradicting and condescending?

Would you pity someone just because they were black? "Oh, I'm so sorry, for those people have been tempted into having dark skin!" I see no difference, except that homosexuality is inside and being black is outside. Both traits are acquired by simply being BORN.


No matter what the debate is about, someone always somehow fit being black into the arguement, as if it's really a bad, and shameful thing. I know alot of people do think being black is bad (racism), but if you're trying to argue about how wrong it is to judge, and you're trying to prove that you're the oppposite, I suggest that you don't bring this comparison into your argument. I know you mean well, and I'm not being sensitive, but I've seen this in many arguements since I've been on DDN, and it's quite tiring, and unnecessary.

You Christians, though, are so unlike him. I doubt that it would ever even occur to Jesus to be condescending like that or to tell people that they are completely wrong ant that that makes them bad people. He would probably just try to get them to accept god anyway. Well, rather than try to convert us, you're just mocking us, and frankly... You're a bad person for doing so


I'm christian, and I believe that being Gay is not a sin. I'm also bisexual, and I've been this way for years... and I'm surely not sorry for my sexuality. There are also alot of Christian gays... they even have their own church since alot of other churches don't accept gays. There are also alot of heterosexual Christians who support gays and are very genuinely nice to people.

Like I said, if you're arguing about being judgemental, some comments shouldn't be said, because they're quite contradicting.

By the way, Zynthia... don't pity homosexuals, because we don't need it. We're happy with being who we are, and we can get by just fine without fake support. I understand you have good intentions, but try being non-judgemental for starters. :?
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