Forum: Advice / Girls Only

Relationship Red Flags (karma: 26)
By Jennamember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Thu Oct 11, 2007 08:31 PM
Edited by JennaNenna (58119) on 2007-10-11 20:40:59 added
Edited by JennaNenna (58119) on 2007-10-11 20:42:23
Made sticky by Theresa (28613) on 2007-10-12 10:44:51

Relationship Red Flags

**Disclaimer**please note that this is only meant to be thought provoking and to insight discussion, not to be a definitive relationship guide or something on which to solely base any decisions.

After a bad relationship experience, I have been speaking with my therapist a lot about potential "warning signs" to watch out for in a relationship. After closely examining my own experience I realize that even in the very beginning there were subtle signs I should have paid more attention to and taken more seriously.

When I say "warning signs", I refer to subtle hints that may be indicative of undesirable qualities within a partner - anger problems, tendencises toward emotional/verbal/sexual/physical abuse, or just someone who is realling dragging you down.

I thought it might be a good idea if we can share some of our personal experiences on the subject - not to scare people, or make them uber-paranoid of their significant other - but just to get everyone thinking.

And as a side note, I don't mean to say that if a guy posses any of these characteristics he is a psychopath who should be avoided at all costs - just things from personal experience I should have paid more attention to. Its never a bad idea to question things that strike you as "odd" - better to be safe than sorry right?

Some personal red flags for me were:

1) He called his mother a very derogatory term. Now in some cases I'm sure you could argue that someone deserves a horrible name attached to them, however his Mom really did EVERYTHING for him, she always did things above and beyond in his best interest. So, if you're dating a new guy or there is a potential candidate for a relationship, watch how he treats other women , family, coworkers, friends etc. If he is consistently speaking poorly of women in his life, you might want to evaluate how much respect he has for women.

2) He didn't like my platonic relationships with other men. This progressively got worse and worse over time. At first it was just him displaying mild annoyance at the fact I spoke with or spent time with male friends. It then turned to him reading all my conversation histories with them on my computer, and checking my cell phone records. It then turned into him beating me up because I ran into a male friend from high school and grabbed a cup of coffee. Bottom line is, if you have given no reason for your guy not to trust you, he should. He should encourage the presence of positive people in your life regardless of their gender. If a guy is asking you to cut people out of your life, and telling you who you can and cannot see, a big red flag should go up.

3) Pay attention to how he treats people in the service industry. It says a lot about a person who is rude to the server when you're out for dinner, or the gas attendant on the way home. My ex viewed people who "served" him, as below him - which became increasingly evident as time progressed. He also viewed me as below him, he was "the man" and therefore always right, and always had the final word. A good guy will respect all people, regardless of gender, race, employment etc - if he doesn't, be wary that he may eventually project this onto you as well.

4) He used intimidation. Even before the physical abuse started, there were hints of physically aggressive behaviour. For example, he would stand above me and tower over me, using his size to try and scare me when we were fighting. Sometimes he would look at me sharply and sort of bear his teeth and clench his neck muscles, or even form a fist. The way a person deals with conflict can be very important. Proceed with caution if your guy tries to intimidate you, breaks or throws objects around you, or uses threats. Physical violence is not just pushing/punching etc - its threatening to use physical violence, and even getting physical with objects, or punching walls etc.

6) Extreme mood swings. In the beginning this started out as him acting annoyed and distant, then next all lovey-dovey. After a while, one second my ex would be screaming at me, telling me I'm worthless and the next he would by stroking my hair saying he loved me and I was the most beautiful girl in the world. In the end the mood swings got to the point where he would walk in the room, punch me in the face, then immediately kiss me and ask if I wanted to go out and eat. Everyone acts irrationally at some point, but if there is consistent irrational behaviour, even if it's not extreme, keep your eyes open.

7) He had no interests outside of our relationship. My ex had plenty of friends and talents, however when we started dating he had no interest in any of them. He insisted we see each other everyday. At first I thought this was cute – but it ended up just being plain creepy. It was 5 months before we went a day without seeing each other. Even if I left the house at 7am, went to school until 4, then worked until 10:30 , he still demanded that I see him. If I wanted to make a trip to Walmart, he had to go. If I went to a doctors appointment, he had to go. By the end I had lost all independence. Time apart wont kill you. People in a relationship should still be able to maintain hobbies, interests and friends they had when single. Its one things to make time for your significant other – its different to be giving up on important things in your life for someone else.

I could probably go on forever about this, but things are getting really long here. The best advice I can offer to anyone in a relationship or thinking of getting into one, is this:

NEVER compromise who you are for anyone.
Its OK to make compromises on things like where to eat for dinner, what movie to rent etc.
But please, NEVER compromise your values and beliefs for someone. You must be happy with yourself and if someone else needs you to or forces you to change something, that's just NOT cool - for lack of better words haha!

I was part of a support group for abused women recently (AMAZING experience!!!) And there was some great wisdom on healthy relationships imparted to me.

Questions to ask yourself about a new partner: (some of these apply to married couple or couples with children)

1)Does he have specific characteristics that you admire? Can you give examples?
2)How many essential characteristics of your "ideal partner" does he have?
3)Does he accept and respect your decisions regarding birth control?
4)Does he think it's a woman's/ mother's right to hold paid employment?
5)Is he willing to let you spend time alone, even if he would like to be with you?
6)Is he glad that you have other friendships?
7)Is he pleased with your accomplishments and ambitions?
8)Does he think women should be confident, independent and assertive?
9)Does he ask for and listen to your opinion about things?
10)Does he both talk AND listen during conversations?
11)Does he tell you about his feelings?
12)Does he express vulnerable feelings? (pain, hurt, sadness, fear, etc)
13)Does he appear to like and admire women in general?
14)Does he treat other women in his life with respect? (mother, sister etc)
15)Does he have good friends?
16)Does he have interests outside of your relationship?
17)Does he take responsibility for his own behaviour and mistakes?
18)Do you feel good about yourself when you are around him?
19)Does he loose his temper suddenly about small things?
20)Does he pressure you for information about your past intimate relationships?
21)Does he expect you to keep him informed of all your daily activities?
22)Does he expect an explanation if you are out late?
23)Does he believe that men should make the important decisions within a relationship?
24)Does he feel that under certain circumstances it is okay for a man to hit a woman?
25)Is he jealous of your friends/family?
26)Does he forbid you from having friendships with other men?
27)Does he accuse you of cheating or planning to cheat on him?
28)Does he feel that men should earn more money than women?
29)Does he belittle your efforts towards personal growth? (education, work etc)
30)Does he expect you to meet your personal needs? (laundry, cooking, cleaning etc)
31)Does he get angry if things are not done his way?
32)When he is hurt, sad or jealous, does he act angry instead?
33)Does he sulk when he is angry?
34)Does he abuse alcohol or other drugs?
35)Does he call you names, redicule you, humiliate you, point out your flaws?
36)Does he blame you or others when he makes a mistake?
37)Does he have a history or criminal behaviour?
38)Was he abused as a child?
39)Did he witness abuse as a child?
40)Do you feel bad about yourself when you around him?
41)Does he put you down when you act indepenantly?
42)If he has children, does he treat them with respect and kindness?
43)Has he ever abused a past intimate partner?
44)Does he tend to act aggressively to others when he is angry?
45)Does he put you down in front of your friends/family?
46)Does he feel that he can "make up" for poor behaviour by buying you things etc?

Characteristics of a Healthy Relationship

-You feel that you are respected as a person
-Your physical and emotional needs are met
-You like the other person and feel liked by them
- You feel appreciated rather than taken for granted
- You are not afraid to be yourself
- You can communicate effectively with your partner
- You affirm and support one another
- Trust is present
- There is a sense of humour and play
- Responsibilities are shared
- Your privacy is respected
- You do not feel pressured to account for your time
- You are not fighting for control
- You hare equally in decisions
- You have a mutually beneficial agreement regarding finances
- Both individuals admit and seek help for their problems
- The desire to spend time together is mutual
- You have sufficient room to grow in the relationship
- You feel good about yourself
-You can tell your partner when you feel hurt or angry, and they can do the same

I apologize for this getting so long. I guess I just wish I had this information and taken it to heart in the very early stages of my relationship with my ex. I hope it with be valuable to someone, and please add any of your own insight! I hate that there are so many people who have to learn things like this the hard way - and most of us know it, but unfortunately we let things slide all to often - which is what I did, and it ended up being catastrophic. So please ladies, be careful.

Wishing everyone happy, healthy relationships,


EDIT: before I get nailed for this - I do want to acknowledge that women are not the only ones that should be careful in relationships and watch out for warning signs - the informtaion I had and my experience relates more to females in this case - and staticts typically show that women are more frequently the victims of abuse in domestic situations and relationships. A lot of this has to do with the age-old beleief that women are second class citizens that is unfortunatly still held by many - that is why I posted in girls only and directed my post at the ladies.

20 Replies to Relationship Red Flags

re: Relationship Red Flags (karma: 3)
By BeckyP2
On Thu Oct 11, 2007 08:45 PM
This is a very good thread, Jenna. Whenever I go on these websites there is usually at least one person in a somewhat abusive situation and doesn't realize it. Abuse does not have to be physical. Emotional abuse takes away your self confidence and respect. I was in a verbally abusive relationship for about three years, and it took me awhile to realize that that's what it was. There were many warning signs, but I chose to ignore them because I felt that underneath it all he was a good guy, that he just needed to grow up a little bit, that things would change...blah blah blah. It ended up getting to a point where I was afraid to voice any kind of opinion because I was afraid of his reaction. It can be a very gradual thing that you don't even realize is happening. All of a sudden you take a step back and think, "whoa, how did I let it get to this point?" A word of advice to all young girls out there is to look at a guy for who he is, not who you would like him to become. Do not spend time trying to read between the lines. Look at his actions and don't make excuses for them.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By Jennamember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Thu Oct 11, 2007 08:52 PM
^ Becky, you make a very important point.

From my personal experience, while the physical abuse was the most painful at the time - its the emotional trauma that I endured that will stick with me the longest. I dont mean to make physical abuse seem insignificat or anything - but its true when they say its the emotional wounds that take the longest to heal..

The whole "sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me" is such a load of hooey - and its beacuse of things like this emotional and verbal abuse isint taken seriously enough.

Little boys are always taught not to hit girls - "its wrong to hit women" - but what about screw around with them mentally? This is waaayyy too often overlooked!!

A word of advice to all young girls out there is to look at a guy for who he is, not who you would like him to become

Amen to that! If you need to CHANGE someone to make them worthy - its just SOOO not worth it - and I bet the success rate is pretty darn slim.

Thanks for sharing your experience Becky!
re: Relationship Red Flags (karma: 2)
By d4jmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Thu Oct 11, 2007 11:06 PM
Look at his actions and don't make excuses for them.

I really wanted to break this out and focus on it because there are so many women who will read Jenna's and Becky's wonderful insights and say "BUT..."

"BUT..... he's under a lot of pressure right now at work."

"BUT..... he's really just misunderstood."

"BUT.... he's had a hard life."

"BUT... aside from his outbursts he's a nice guy."

"BUT... it's only because he feels so much for me that he gets this way."

Etc., etc.

I have posted many times about my sister's ongoing plight with an abusive ex. For years she gave all of us a long list of "buts". She understands now, but for a long time she just was not willing to listen. EVERY woman should check each relationship she has with every man - go through this list - and be willing to take a good hard look at anything that is revealed.
re: Relationship Red Flags (karma: 3)
By webstArmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Thu Oct 11, 2007 11:49 PM
Edited by webstAr (54294) on 2007-10-11 23:50:59
Wow, what a fantastic post. Thank you so much for writing this all out.

Up until a little while ago, I was in a relationship that you described to a T. Except for the physical abuse - my ex always told me that he would never hit a woman - but it was totally ok for him to mess with my mind and generally make me feel worthless. And I was with his for over three years.

It took me moving to another country - over 7 hours (flying) away AND meeting my current boyfriend to realize that I deserve SO much better. And I have that now, and I couldn't be happier. I know our relationship now isn't perfect - maybe living in the same country would help ;) but I'm treated with a million times more respect now than I ever was with my past boyfriend.

I chalk it up to him being incredibly insecure.. and slightly delusional.

He treated his mother and sister like CRAP. He would swear at him while they were just trying to talk to me. His 6 year old sister would try and show me something she did, or tell me a story - she looked up to me SO much - and he would tell her to eff off. She was 6!! I was told very early on, to look at the way your boyfriend treats his mother - because one day, that will be you.

I wasn't even "allowed" to hang out with my friends in dance who were male. They were GAY! But no, I couldn't hang out with them - it made him uncomfortable.

He literally dropped ALL of his friends around grade 11, because he claimed that they didn't add anything to his life, and he was far too mature to hang out with them anymore. I think he just didn't want ME anywhere near him.

By the end of our relationship, when we fought - I just stopped caring. I turned myself off emotionally, so I didn't feel any pain when we fought. I didn't cry, I hardly even talked. It got to the point where I would just agree with him to end the fight, but then we'd get into a fight about how I'm "hiding my feelings" and not telling him how I really feel. So there'd be a new fight.

I think the real issue, is that he saw me as this weak, meak, unconfidant girl that needed a "strong" man to make me a better person. He told me over and over again that I was confidant because of him when in reality, he made me feel worse and worse about myself as the relationship progressed.

He would never congratulate me on my acomplishments, until I said something about it and basically asked him to congratulate me. He told me that dance was just a "hobby" - even though I was working as a professional dancer.

ARGGHHH.. It just infuriates me to think of all the bull crap I put up with for SO long when I could have been independant, hanging out with my friends, and just having a good time! I couldn't even go out with my friends before I OKed it with him first.

The real problem is that I had people telling me left, right, and center that I deserved better and should get out of the relationship - but it was impossible to listen. I made excuses, I lied and pretended that things were better than they were because I couldn't handle the humiliation of dating someone so horrible. I wish I could say "I wish I read a post like this, I would have left him!" but the truth is - everyone told me to get out but for some horrible reason, I couldn't listen. Like I said - it took meeting my current boyfriend, and spending time to get to know him and realizing how I could be treated that made me leave my ex with zero regrets.

I hate that girls get into these positions (and guys, respectively - girls can be absolute controlling witches too) and it's SO hard to get out.

But I promise all of you - IT GET'S BETTER! And even more than that - YOU DESERVE SOOOOO MUCH BETTER.
re: Relationship Red Flags (karma: 2)
By Incarnadinemember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Fri Oct 12, 2007 09:25 AM
First- I want to thank you Jenna and Webstar for sharing your stories. I'm so sorry you both went through this, but I'm glad it's over and you're both safe and sound.

I also think I speak for everyone when I say THANK YOU for sharing your experiences; your situations may help girls prevent getting into abusive sitution, and it may help girls currently in abusive situations to see what is really going on in their relationships.

As for the topic:

I want to stress the importantace of having self love and self worth.

Abusive people (male or female) often target a person based on their lack of self love/worth/confidence. This is because they know you can be easily manipulated and broken down to be at their mercy- emotionally, mentally or physically.

Unfortunatly, abuse in all its forms is pretty common. And everyne I've ever known in abusive situations stayed because they felt:
~ They couldn't find anyone else bettter.
~ No one better would WANT them.
~ They don't think they deserve/are worthy of anything better.
~ They would rather take being treated badly or hurt in order to have a "I'd rather been in this situation than be alone."

Which is why we need to stress the importance of learning to LOVE yourself and knowing you are WORTH something.

NO one deserves to be hurt physically or emotionally. And no guy willing to hurt you is worthy of YOU- it's not the other way around.

D4J makes a REALLY important point: DO NOT MAKE EXCUSES FOR YOUR OWN ABUSE. Abuse begins subtly. And the more you take- the farther it will go. Abuse begins with "little" things and builds to be more severe the longer you take it. Do not lie to yourself thinking "It'll get better" or "We're just going through hard times."

The saddest part of abuse is that people who are in abusive situations often makes excuses for their abuser or convince themselves it's "ok." It's NEVER ok.

A final point, then I'll stop. Most people know when they're being physically abused- but sometimes people don't realize they're being emotionally/mentally abused until they're up to their nose in it. This is probably because they make the vary excuses D4J pointed out "He was just mad" or "His childhood was messed up- so he just doesn't know how to handle things."

These are not good excuses- there ARE NO GOOD EXCUSES. Being mad, having a bad day or a sad childhood doesn't give ANYone the right to hurt someone else. EVER.

I think we all know there are a lot of women and girls out there (and on this site) who are in abusive relationships or are in danger of getting into abusive relationships because they don't realize they're worth more.

I really hope those people see this, read it and take a good hard look at their relationships- and themselves.
re: Relationship Red Flags (karma: 1)
By PinUpGirlmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Fri Oct 12, 2007 09:33 AM
This really makes me appreciate my boyfriend more. It was so touching to read others' experiences and how they came out on top. You go, girls.

I'd like to see this stickified. I think it's a valuable resource for all women and girls. We make excuses every day, but you should never make an excuse for something like physical or emotional abuse. Saying an abuser is a "nice guy" when he's not having one of his outbursts is like saying Hitler was a nice guy except for that whole Jew thing.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By Incarnadinemember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Fri Oct 12, 2007 09:44 AM
Edited by Incarnadine (15186) on 2007-10-12 10:35:37
Saying an abuser is a "nice guy" when he's not having one of his outbursts is like saying Hitler was a nice guy except for that whole Jew thing.

Heh- excellent point.

When I gave you karma the "reason" I gave was cut off- and it's something I really wanted to say to you.

While I'm so sorry you suffered through abuse- I'm so greatful you have shared this and have made a point to help others.

I recall your story from another post and what you went through was horrific. You are very brave and courageous to share your story. Many women would try to hide it or feel ashamed, but you seem to know you have NO reason to be ashamed and you are willing to put yourself out there for a greater good. That makes you a wonderful person and inspiration in my book.

I really wish more women would stand up like you to shed light on this way-too-common issue.

I also wanted to tell you that words cannot discribe how amazing you are for your daughter. You did the single most loving, nobel and brave thing you could ever do for your child by getting out. She is too little to know it- but someday she will be thankful to you.

You have given her a great gift- the chance to grow up surrounded by love and strength. And your wisdom and experience will be instilled in her.

I wish you both the absolute best.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By d4jmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:59 AM
Yea for this being made a sticky - great job Jenna!!!


re: Relationship Red Flags
By webstArmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Fri Oct 12, 2007 01:22 PM
This really makes me appreciate my boyfriend more.

Oh, this is so unbelieveably true for me too - with my boyfriend.

I've finally understood how a relationship is supposed to work. He is always so caring, and respectful towards me.

When he took me out on my first date, I told him at the end of the night that I had never been treated like that on a date before and he was just shocked because he didn't feel like he had tried to go above and beyond at all - he was just being himself.

He is my biggest source of support for what I'm doing in my life right now. He's a musician - so we understand each other's goals and dreams in life without trivializing them. He's never talked down to me, or patronized me in any way, even though he has a hell of a lot more life experience including 4 years at university, and travelling the world. He treats me as his equal. He respects his family and that is aboslutely huge to me - it's fantastic to watch him interact with them. He has a large circle of friends that are all amazing too.

He literally is the best thing that's happened to me - and it feels so much better to talk about how fantastic he is, than how much of a jerk my ex was :)

Just to reiterate what I was saying earlier - there are more guys like him out there, I promise! And once you find them, you'll know that you'll never allow yourself to be treated anything less than what you 100% deserve - and all of you beautiful, talented, intelligent girls deserve to be treated with the utmost respect and love.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By maureensiobhan
On Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:13 AM
I can understand this post. My sister-in-law could not see (or didn't want to see) the red flags when she and my brother were dating. I have no idea why she ignored the red flags of potential verbal and financial abuse.

For example, he would say some mean things at home and in front of other people to her and about her. He told her once that he was ashamed to be seen in public with her because she was very busty. While they were dating, he went to talk to her about breaking up. This was when she got pregnant for the first time. She did it to try to keep him. He talked with her once about separating for a while. Here again, she diliberately got pregnant to try to keep him. He would always stand here yelling and screaming at her when he got drunk. There was another red flag she ignored. He never got out to try to find a job either, so there was financial abuse. When we tried to get her to see how he was with her, she would always make excuses for his behavior.

She didn't finally open her eyes and ears until twenty years later, when we were preparing for my niece's wedding. She finally told him, "Enough is enough. Get lost.". He was and still is in shock that she finally spoke up to him.

Ladies, it cannot be stressed enough. Keep your ears and eyes open.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By ReelTrebleMaker
On Wed Dec 12, 2007 04:06 PM
Thanks, Jenna. My boyfriend and I just went on a "break" (if a break means that he changed his Myspace status back to single...) and I was feeling pretty low, but I honestly realize that there was a lot wrong with this relationship. Not that it really makes me feel any less crappy, but thanks :)
re: Relationship Red Flags
By zatani
On Wed Jan 02, 2008 03:27 AM
This is really amazing. You really have helped me. Thank you!!
re: Relationship Red Flags
By BeautifulMistakemember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Thu Feb 28, 2008 04:02 PM
I didn't read all of it, but I'm sure it'll be VERY helpful to girls here. I hope lots of us read it and remember it.

Thanks for putting it together.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By Orionmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Fri Feb 29, 2008 05:16 PM
Reading this brought tears to my eyes. I wish I could have found this last spring, when I needed it so badly. I knew I was being abused, but I continued to cover up the bruises with makeup and make excuses for this boy. I really want to be able to say that I finally got stronger, and got out of the relationship, but I didn't. It took him telling me that he was leaving to be with this other girl, that he'd loved her all along and had tried to make me her.

I don't know why I was with him. I was hurting and scared already, from losing the person I really loved. It was the worst decision of my life. He left me with scars, literally and figuratively. It's so hard to trust people now. I wish I'd read this so much sooner. Maybe that would have gotten me to see.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By Pongomember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Sat Mar 15, 2008 12:04 PM
I'm never sure, with my boyfriend. Like, it used to be really bad, quite like your situation. I couldn't wear anything remotely revealing, I couldn't talk to other guys, I couldn't drink, couldn't go out with my friends. There was always so much fighting... he would go through my long list of insecurities one by one ('everything you have is because of me, you're such a fat ass, etc. etc.) and we always got physical. Sometimes I would do it first though, he would just hit back harder. So I guess that's kind of my fault. I still have a bite mark that scarred, i couldn't wear short sleaved shirts for weeks.

He's gotten so much better now though. He wants me to go out with my friends, I wear whatever I want, he's getting counseling for anger issues, and when we fight, it's usually because I get mad at him, not the other way around. I've just been really confused right now. Was it ever an abusive relationship in the first place, and is it possible that he really changed? I don't want to leave him. I'm just scared someday it will go back to how it was.

I don't know where I'm going with this, really. Just rambling I guess, sorry go hijack!
re: Relationship Red Flags
By BeckyP2
On Sat Mar 15, 2008 07:16 PM

It was definitely abusive if he was telling you what to wear and who to hang out with. It sounds like it has gotten better. However, keep an eye out. How long has it been since things have been better? Often times those improvements don't last too long. I'm not trying to bring you down, but think long and hard about your relationship. If you are not happy with your boyfriend, do not be afraid to leave the relationship behind. You deserve to be treated respectfully.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By bobotPremium member
On Thu May 08, 2008 10:26 PM
I think that it is very caring of you to post all of this great advice for young will they learn if we don't give them our advice
re: Relationship Red Flags
By CGgirl_11
On Sat May 10, 2008 08:32 PM
Wow...that was really inspiring... =]
I made me realize that some of my friends need to take a better look at there boyfriends. I dont have a boyfriend right now, partly because i realized some of the things you said were going on and thats all cool with me.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By mrslovettmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Sat May 10, 2008 11:28 PM
This is one of my favorite posts that I've ever seen. I didn't know half the things on here, like that violence is not just the actual act of hitting someone, but even threatening to. If I hadn't read this, I'd just play stuff like threats down, saying they were meaningless, but now I know...

Thank you SO MUCH. Really. You have no idea.
re: Relationship Red Flags
By freenky
On Sun Aug 31, 2008 12:04 AM
Thanks for this excellent guide on relationships!


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