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Tap - Advanced
Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By oz_helenmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 11196, member since Sat Aug 10, 2002
On Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:48 PM

This is a sister thread to the Speed Tap thread.

I'll be back to comment later.

Helen

27 Replies to Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!

re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By adageacemember has saluted, click to view salute photos Comments: 3982, member since Thu Sep 01, 2005
On Mon Jan 12, 2009 03:18 PM
I've been trying to think of a good discussion point, and all I can come up with is this:

With regards to teaching slow tap, how do you find it stylistically? And do the students enjoy it, or prefer faster stuff?

When my teacher was choreographing my solo, she told me she was looking forward to being able to do something a little more mature. The music she chose is without a doubt the slowest used for any solo in the school. She's also commented about how the teens in my school seem to dislike this style in general, no matter what genre.

What I'm not sure of is whether that's an age thing, a personal taste thing, a trend that's developed in my studio and is filtering through to the students, or what.

Also - what do you define as slow tap? Is it still 'slow' if the majority of the steps are double time to the music?

Finally - for waltz tap. I am always being told that 3/4 music is hard to get hold of. Anyone care to share any 3/4 music?
I have - and this is not an exhaustive list, just off the top of my head; nor is it all necessarily great for tap, just songs I've noticed are 3/4:
The Corrs - Erin Shore
Seal - Kiss From a Rose
Norah Jones - Come Away With Me
Rise Against - Swing Life Away
Metallica - Nothing Else Matters (I have an instrumental version by Apocalyptica)
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By oz_helenmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 11196, member since Sat Aug 10, 2002
On Mon Jan 12, 2009 09:58 PM
I agree: it is hard to find good music in 3/4, which is why a lot of people hate doing waltz tap. A lot of teachers resort to the tried and true dinky old songs like "Tammy" (I remember dancing to this when I young) and the recordings are often poor quality too.

Other music I know of that is overused for waltz routines are "Moon River", "A Time For Us" (from the Franco Zeferelli version of Romeo and Juliet) and... oh I've hit a blank. I'd have to go through my old tapes to see what else I've had to tap to.

I have used Kiss from a Rose for a competition solo before (for a student, not for myself), but I wouldn't class it as slow at all. Stylistically, a lot of the arms and combinations of steps were similar to a slow tap solo: fluid and soft arms, more balletic lines, plenty of wings, ripples, large brushes and hops instead of compact steps that you would find in a speed and more light than shade in the dynamics. But the main difference between a waltz of this tempo and a true slow routine is the control required.

Steps need to have more space between all the sounds so as to not get in front of the beat. This is more challenging than it sounds, especially for a student used to working at speed. Each step needs to have flow, so it's not just a matter of making the movements bigger, in fact, making them too large reduces the control you have.

Helen
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By glitterfairyPremium member Comments: 12135, member since Tue Oct 01, 2002
On Tue Jan 13, 2009 04:49 AM
More ab control is also really important in slows. It's easier to get away with technical hitches in fast things because the sheer number of movements (and hence, body movements) is so much higher. Turning wing kicks? With anything airborne, if you didn't have good technique, you'd fall over, or sprain an ankle. It takes even better technique to make it look good.

Good transition is also crucial to good waltzes and slows. Again, easier to fudge in speed taps, but can come up as a weakness within slows and waltzes.


"Ugh, Slow Tap!" is common over here too, but not if it's done well. Waltz Tap's I've done include a hiphop song done in waltz time. Neyo's "Things That I miss" is in waltz, as is Avril Lavigne's "Keep Holding On", and some of Goo Goo Doll's "Iris". Ingrid Michaelson has a number of songs in waltz too. Alicia Key's "Fallin" could be a waltz too.
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By oz_helenmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 11196, member since Sat Aug 10, 2002
On Tue Jan 13, 2009 06:02 AM
Edited by oz_helen (35388) on 2009-01-13 06:16:30 typo
^Actually, I'd say that "Fallin'" is a real stretch for a waltz. Just because something is in compound time (in this case, 12/8), doesn't automatically give it a feeling of three. "Fallin'" definitely would qualify for a slow tap, but the strong back beat is too hard to ignore.

"Iris" is also not a good choice for a waltz solo because of the frequent time signature changes. It's impossible to edit it down to just the 12/8 parts. It'd work as a slow though.

I find that I'm much better at slow and waltz tap than speed tap. This is most likely because my style, control and body awareness is so strong, but my stamina (which you really need in speed tap) is shot at the moment because of lack of overall fitness.

Helen
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By DancerTonitePremium member Comments: 518, member since Mon Aug 22, 2005
On Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:40 AM
Ok - I'm going to play dumb for a second...I've been tapping for 34 years and have never heard of a Waltz Tap...what is that?
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By adageacemember has saluted, click to view salute photos Comments: 3982, member since Thu Sep 01, 2005
On Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:52 AM
Exactly what it sounds like. Tap done to waltz time (3/4). :)
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By glitterfairyPremium member Comments: 12135, member since Tue Oct 01, 2002
On Fri Jan 16, 2009 09:34 PM
oz_helen wrote:

^Actually, I'd say that "Fallin'" is a real stretch for a waltz. Just because something is in compound time (in this case, 12/8), doesn't automatically give it a feeling of three. "Fallin'" definitely would qualify for a slow tap, but the strong back beat is too hard to ignore.

This is true. Waltz tap for competitive purposes, however ;)

Thinking on it more, I really like the 'lilt' feeling within waltzes. I'm instinctively much better at light than I am at shading, so it's nice to have 'mostly light' as a base with 'even lighter' for textual layering. :)

Side note? I've got to say that proper waltz and slow training isn't very common over here except where competitive soloists are concerned (even then it's largely for championship purposes where you HAVE to do contrasting routines, or a few of of A/B/C/D categories to qualify). I've never seen a high-level group routine done in slow or waltz tap... now there's something that might be worth exploring at a later date ;)
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By tappergurl Comments: 123, member since Tue Feb 01, 2005
On Sun Jan 25, 2009 05:39 PM
A waltz clog choreographed by the teacher is required in the ADAPT pre-intermediate 3 tap exam, we usually use the Oscar Meyer song (Hot diggity dog diggity) or Take me out to the ballgame. Both choices make for an awful experience once you've listened to the songs 4 or 5 times a week for a couple months each year! Does anyone have any thoughts on what makes a waltz clog different from a straight waltz? Apparently there isn't a lot of "true waltz clog" music available.
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By glitterfairyPremium member Comments: 12135, member since Tue Oct 01, 2002
On Mon Jan 26, 2009 09:17 PM
They don't have waltz clogs in either of the two syllabi I've mainly studied from, but I have definitely heard the term mentioned in class before... *strains to recall*

Helen? This sounds like something you might know more about.
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By Nic79 Comments: 24, member since Sat Jun 21, 2008
On Thu Jan 29, 2009 03:38 PM
I'm currently choreographing a tap piece to Mr Bojangles

Oh and this is my first post in here so Hi!
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By oz_helenmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 11196, member since Sat Aug 10, 2002
On Fri Jan 30, 2009 06:31 AM
Welcome Nic.

Waltz clog - well, since clogging itself is pretty much unknown in Australia, the only thing I know about a waltz clog is what I would call a waltz timestep: Spring shuffle ball change. There's a certain tempo of music that works with the timestep and yes, it is very hard to find non-dodgy music at that time signature. Is that what you meant, Tappergurl?

Helen
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By majeremember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 5889, member since Sat Sep 29, 2007
On Wed Feb 04, 2009 01:11 PM
oz_helen wrote:

Welcome Nic.

Waltz clog - well, since clogging itself is pretty much unknown in Australia, the only thing I know about a waltz clog is what I would call a waltz timestep: Spring shuffle ball change. There's a certain tempo of music that works with the timestep and yes, it is very hard to find non-dodgy music at that time signature. Is that what you meant, Tappergurl?

Helen


interesting.
for me a waltz clog is:
step shuffle ball-change or flap shuffle ball-change etc.
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By glitterfairyPremium member Comments: 12135, member since Tue Oct 01, 2002
On Wed Feb 04, 2009 07:41 PM
That's known colloquially in my school as a 'Waltz Step' :)
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By oz_helenmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 11196, member since Sat Aug 10, 2002
On Wed Feb 04, 2009 07:44 PM
Majere, it's exactly the same, except with my version there's a bit more air-time. ;)

Helen
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By majeremember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 5889, member since Sat Sep 29, 2007
On Wed Feb 04, 2009 08:44 PM
oz_helen wrote:

Majere, it's exactly the same, except with my version there's a bit more air-time. ;)

Helen


I need to try it that way now :). I assume spring = hop?
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By oz_helenmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 11196, member since Sat Aug 10, 2002
On Wed Feb 04, 2009 09:13 PM
A hop is done on one leg, i.e. you stand on one foot, hop and land on the same foot. A spring changes feet, i.e. you stand on one foot, spring and land on the other foot.

Helen
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By majeremember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 5889, member since Sat Sep 29, 2007
On Wed Feb 04, 2009 09:50 PM
oz_helen wrote:

A hop is done on one leg, i.e. you stand on one foot, hop and land on the same foot. A spring changes feet, i.e. you stand on one foot, spring and land on the other foot.

Helen


sweet. I will go and try it this way.

(This would be a simpler convo if we could see each others feet.)
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By tappergurl Comments: 123, member since Tue Feb 01, 2005
On Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:56 PM
I use spring as the base to describe anything that leaves the floor. A hop lands on the same foot, a jump lands on two feet and a leap lands on the opposite foot.
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By oz_helenmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 11196, member since Sat Aug 10, 2002
On Thu Feb 05, 2009 01:58 PM
^And once again we see how the terminology varies throughout the world. :)

Was that what you were referring to (the waltz clog)?

Helen
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By adageacemember has saluted, click to view salute photos Comments: 3982, member since Thu Sep 01, 2005
On Thu Feb 05, 2009 02:30 PM
Another one who calls it a waltz step here. If it's spring shuffle ball change, it's a basic or single waltz step. Tap spring (flap) shuffle ball change, it's a double waltz step.

They're a nice little step, I really enjoy doing them.
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By oz_helenmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 11196, member since Sat Aug 10, 2002
On Thu Feb 05, 2009 02:34 PM
Oh and the triple is Shuffle Spring Shuffle Ball Change. &a 1 & 2 & 3

In my home syllabus, before the revamp, this step was the basis of our Waltz Timestep and Break for our junior levels.

Helen
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By tappergurl Comments: 123, member since Tue Feb 01, 2005
On Thu Feb 05, 2009 03:22 PM
Yes, the basic waltz clog step we use to build off of is leap shuffle ball change. We then use other variations on the count of 1 &2 &3 (leap shuffle leap toe, flap shuffle ball change, etc) to choreograph a "waltz clog" piece for the exam. I'm thinking that maybe the accents are in different places to make it different from a straight waltz?? It specifically states that the piece must be a waltz clog and not a true waltz or a polka. I wish I had my syllabus with me so I could quote it verbatim but I'm snowed in right now and it's at the studio!
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By majeremember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member Comments: 5889, member since Sat Sep 29, 2007
On Thu Feb 05, 2009 05:58 PM
tappergurl wrote:

I use spring as the base to describe anything that leaves the floor. A hop lands on the same foot, a jump lands on two feet and a leap lands on the opposite foot.


To me jump and leap are used interchagebly.

But I'm finding to convo interesting to read, despite the fact that I have no real input on the topic.
re: Waltz and Slow Tap - Discuss!
By tappergurl Comments: 123, member since Tue Feb 01, 2005
On Thu Feb 05, 2009 08:05 PM
The syllabus I use has really specific terminology so that there isn't a lot of ambiguity in whether something changes weight or not or if something is accented or not etc. I like it because I'm a little bit psycho when it comes to terminology (with my own students - I realize everyone's is different depending on your region or experience or syllabus).
Getting back on topic, I really like slow tap if it's done well. I used Elton John's "Your Song" for a solo last year. I find that slow tap songs work better for solos than for a group since it's so difficult to count - you always have a few kids that can pull them off because they carry the rhythm in the group routines.

Also, has anyone else heard of the term "lyrical tap" lately? I think it might be stemming from the whole "lyrical hip hop" trend.
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