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re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By dancinqt5013member has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Fri Nov 06, 2009 02:30 PM
I think it's kind of obvious that what she did in no way fits the definition of traditional blackface. However, I can see how what she did could be interpreted as some form of modern blackface. She is clearly portraying a stereotype and when I first saw the picture and the title of this thread, I thought that was a little offensive of her to dress up like that for Halloween. But that was before I read the part about her dressing up specifically as Lil Wayne. Now, it just so happens that Lil Wayne wears baggy clothes, has a grill, and is black. Just because he fits a common stereotype doesn't mean that this girl is only portraying a stereotype. She's being Lil Wayne for Halloween, not "a black rapper". If she's going to be Lil Wayne, I don't see how it would work if she didn't paint her skin, tbh. Plenty of people paint their skin for Halloween. How come people can dress up as Oprah and paint their skin without it being offensive? Is it because Oprah doesn't happen to fit a stereotype commonly associated with black people?

I don't really like this girl's costume and I think there are way better costumes for her to come up with. But the fact is, she did not paint her skin to portray a certain stereotype commonly associated with a specific race. She painted her skin to be a specific person, which I don't find offensive in the least.


Oh yeah, and apparently "Lil" is netspeak now. Grr, DDN.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By kandykanePremium member
On Fri Nov 06, 2009 02:36 PM
My suggested costume was also portaying a specific person or persons. Some of you may have missed the reference. Many people would be extremly offended if thay encountered someone dressed in a robe with a shaved head and an X carved in their forhead on Halloween.

If you missed the reference, it makes it no less offensive.

kk~
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By MaxwellPremium member
On Fri Nov 06, 2009 06:11 PM
dancinqt5013 wrote:

I think it's kind of obvious that what she did in no way fits the definition of traditional blackface. However, I can see how what she did could be interpreted as some form of modern blackface. She is clearly portraying a stereotype and when I first saw the picture and the title of this thread, I thought that was a little offensive of her to dress up like that for Halloween. But that was before I read the part about her dressing up specifically as Lil Wayne. Now, it just so happens that Lil Wayne wears baggy clothes, has a grill, and is black. Just because he fits a common stereotype doesn't mean that this girl is only portraying a stereotype. She's being Lil Wayne for Halloween, not "a black rapper". If she's going to be Lil Wayne, I don't see how it would work if she didn't paint her skin, tbh. Plenty of people paint their skin for Halloween. How come people can dress up as Oprah and paint their skin without it being offensive? Is it because Oprah doesn't happen to fit a stereotype commonly associated with black people?

I don't really like this girl's costume and I think there are way better costumes for her to come up with. But the fact is, she did not paint her skin to portray a certain stereotype commonly associated with a specific race. She painted her skin to be a specific person, which I don't find offensive in the least.


Oh yeah, and apparently "Lil" is netspeak now. Grr, DDN.


When did anyone say LW was only offensive because it is a stereotype and Oprah wasn't? If I recall, the entire time I've been here I've been saying "Blackface is offensive because X." Not "LW is offensive because X." I have a problem with blackface, not the rapper. Go as Lil Wayne, go as Oprah, go as Obama, Condoleeza, Kanye, whatever. Just don't go in blackface.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween (karma: 3)
By Ladedamember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Fri Nov 06, 2009 09:11 PM
What people aren't grasping is that it's not the act of putting on that make up that is so offensive. It's the INTENTION.

In the past, blackface was associated with being racist, offensive, and hurtful because they used to sterotypically depict and exploit the african american race in a comedic manner. The act of emphasizing certain features to portray the race as a whole and pulling stereotypes to make fun of them is the offense.
The act of darkening the skin is just historically associated with it.

So while you may call altering the skin tone 'blackfacing', black facing is really and honestly, at its core, referring to capitalizing on the race by comedically emphasizing various features and stereotypes. THAT is why it is so racist.

She did none of that. YES she altered her skin tone. Her intentions are in NO way connected to black facing though, so I really don't believe that is even the correct term. She was depicting a specific individual and getting into character. Like most people do.
And why is going to a tanning bed such as Elizabeth does, compared to black facing?

Black facing is about the INTENTION guys, not the act of applying make up. Apply make up was just way of emphasizing a feature, and called it black facing because that was obviously the largest identifier.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween (karma: 1)
By Munkensteinmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Sat Nov 07, 2009 08:45 AM
My suggested costume was also portaying a specific person or persons. Some of you may have missed the reference. Many people would be extremly offended if thay encountered someone dressed in a robe with a shaved head and an X carved in their forhead on Halloween.

If you want to be a crazy criminal for Halloween, go ahead, but unless Lil Wayne is a criminal of some sort, I really don't think it's comparable. That's why I don't think that Prince Harry's nazi costume can be paralleled here either...he dressed as an offensive character, and while I'm sure some people are offended by Lil Wayne in some way, HE is not known for being a racist who supports genocide or whatever else. Everybody seems to love throwing in these extreme "What if..." questions that don't really line up with the topic at hand...let's use more substance in our posts. :P
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By LeSoulierVertmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Sat Nov 07, 2009 04:54 PM
Also, isn't Halloween supposed to be kind of offensive? A lot of it is about ghosts and goblins, and getting scared, and dressing up like an ex murderer or a zombie. I saw a girl dress up as a pregnant woman with a child busting out of her stomach. People though it was funny/reminicent of Bella Swan. None of those are offensive, but Lil' Wayne is... Uh huh, makes perfect sense.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By Bobbee
On Sat Nov 07, 2009 05:00 PM
Hmmm. I've seen old pictures of people in blackface, and they actually wore black paint, not brown. I don't see anything racist in what she did. A black guy dressed up as Susan Boyle this year, light face paint and all. It seems like people like to scream racist any chance they get, and its REAlly getting old. jezebel.com . . .
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By LlamaLlamaDuckmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Sat Nov 07, 2009 05:28 PM
Would a white person complain if a black person painted themselves white?

I quite honestly think that people have become overly sensitve. One of our local schools banned To Kill a Mockingbird because of the use of the N word... one parent complained... YET those same student run around the hallways calling each other by that word.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By Shhaan_Dmember has saluted, click to view salute photos
On Sat Nov 07, 2009 06:05 PM
My thought immediately was, what about the black people who paint themselves white for Halloween. We dont get bothered and it wouldn't make national news.

If she was specifically being racist over it, then yes fair enough, but no. It was a costume!!!
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween (karma: 1)
By AinetheDragonPremium member
On Sun Nov 08, 2009 06:23 PM
Blackface is offensive because it is a parody, an insult in itself.

Dressing up like someone who has darker skin then you and wearing make-up to match is not the same thing in my book.

Part of my own philosophy of Halloween costumes is that they are "come as you arent" instead of "come as you are". I dont think a Lil Wayne costume with pale white skin would be as recognizable. Sure, she'd be pegged as a rapper, but maybe not a specific person. A Michael Jackson costume would be different because the outfit and certain iconic accessories would make it obvious, even if you didnt look at all like him. The point of the costume was not to mock or parody, but probably more to tribute. The point of the make-up was to get the identification across, not to stereotype. Acting like Lil Wayne to get into the character of the costume is also part of it, and not the same as painting her skin black and stereotyping black people in mockery.

Personally, I think that this costume is not 100% admirable taste-wise, but I dont think its racist, or as offensive as some are making it out to be. I dont think its racist at all to accept this kind of costuming. I also dont have a problem with a black person dressing as Brittany Spears for halloween painting their skin white. It would, however, be offensive for a black person to dress up as "white trash" or "a redneck".


I think theres a difference between a white person portraying a stereotype of a black person in parody, and a person with very light skin wearing make-up as part of a costume portraying a person who has dark skin.

This costume does have the potential to offend people, espcially if someone does not know who she is dressed up as. I dont think its a big enough deal for it to be worthy of national news.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By pinktutu
On Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:23 AM
Im quite shocked by most of the comments in this thread. I find what she did as inappropriate. And to be quite honest I don't understand why someone needs to paint there face lighter or darker in order to play such a well know person. I mean why not do everything but the face paint?

Blackface is inappropriate. There is an awful history behind it and anyone who rubs makeup on their face in order to look like a black person specific or not is being inappropriate. Im also surprised by how many people are trying to say she used brown face paint so it's ok. Seriously?

I live in NY so I have seen more then my fair share of halloween costumes good, bad, and ugly. To be honest there is no need to put on face-paint to portray a very famous individual. I went to public school and any "inappropriate" costumes were either sent home or forced to change. If you put on black-face, "white-face" whatever it had to come off.

Maybe I just come from a much different environment but i've always been taught that just because you intend something doesn't change how it comes across. Im sure she wasn't trying to be offensive in dressing as Little Wayne but the fact that is it is offensive.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By kandykanePremium member
On Mon Nov 09, 2009 07:31 AM
Edited by kandykane (157761) on 2009-11-09 07:32:26
Edited by kandykane (157761) on 2009-11-09 07:40:23
Munkenstein wrote:

My suggested costume was also portaying a specific person or persons. Some of you may have missed the reference. Many people would be extremly offended if thay encountered someone dressed in a robe with a shaved head and an X carved in their forhead on Halloween.

If you want to be a crazy criminal for Halloween, go ahead, but unless Lil Wayne is a criminal of some sort, I really don't think it's comparable. That's why I don't think that Prince Harry's nazi costume can be paralleled here either...he dressed as an offensive character, and while I'm sure some people are offended by Lil Wayne in some way, HE is not known for being a racist who supports genocide or whatever else. Everybody seems to love throwing in these extreme "What if..." questions that don't really line up with the topic at hand...let's use more substance in our posts. :P


I was gone this weekend and let most of this debate get away from me. But I just wanted to say that my point was that a costume may have absolutely no meaning to some people but to others it may mean something else entirely. (I really wasn't comparing Lil Wayne to the Manson family, per se.) It's all in the translation. And some things can get lost or changed in the translate.

EDIT: It seems to me the choice of a costume that causes such a backlash, regardless of intent, should be reconsidered.

kk~
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By Munkensteinmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:39 AM
Im sure she wasn't trying to be offensive in dressing as Little Wayne but the fact that is it is offensive.

Obviously it's not a fact...

But I just wanted to say that my point was that a costume may have absolutely no meaning to some people but to others it may mean something else entirely. (I really wasn't comparing Lil Wayne to the Manson family, per se.) It's all in the translation. And some things can get lost or changed in the translate.

Yeah, and this girl dressed up as a rapper...I'm sure that Lil Wayne doesn't offend anybody except for people whose ears hate the assault provided by his music. People who know who he is were probably amused and people who don't know who he is knew she was some rapper. Cool. Yet if you dress as a murderer, a Nazi, or whatever else, that's a whole different type of thing. Oh wait, I said that already...this thing is going in circles. Drat.

As has been said time and time again, it is not always the fault of the person who is misinterpreted when people are "offended" by something they say or do. It cannot be helped that some people are more uptight, sensitive, thinner-skinned, or whatever else...everything offends somebody! I'm sure one person decided they were offended by this girl's costume and decided to make a big deal about it...then it got exaggerated and put on the news and blah blah. Like I said, energy should be used for things that are actually offensive and hateful, not used for blowing petty things out of proportion. She was not insulting anybody. If somebody wants to twist around what she did and get upset about it, that's their problem. I love the gap in reactions across generations and various other demographics.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By kandykanePremium member
On Mon Nov 09, 2009 01:28 PM
Edited by kandykane (157761) on 2009-11-09 13:32:46
I agree that the media contributed to this incident. The same happened in my son's college town, as I related on page 1 of this thread. Surely they have better things to report. The costume was still in bad taste.

Keep on mind this happened in Dallas, a southern city. I'm not far from Dallas. Texas was one of the last states to integrate schools. High minority population. In fact, caucasions are no longer in the majority. Racism is still alive in this area.

Obviously, that girl didn't hear about what happened in my son's nearby college town. I don't know how anyone could have missed it, but the media reaction to the MLK party should have been a clue that maybe the Lil Wayne costume wasn't such a good idea.

kk~
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By Brittanymember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Mon Nov 09, 2009 02:13 PM
Edited by Brittany (36942) on 2009-11-09 14:15:42
I know I am aware that racism is still alive...and I'm sure Munk does too as we have both lived in Georgia.

I just don't feel that dressing up as a particular black person for Halloween is a racist move. I just do not see a problem in using dark make up to cover your skin for Halloween. It's the day you can dress up us what you want to.

I saw a picture of a girl on facebook with my friend (both black girls) and one was dressed up as the Joker from Batman with white makeup on her face. Is this wrong?
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By kandykanePremium member
On Mon Nov 09, 2009 02:38 PM
Edited by kandykane (157761) on 2009-11-09 14:42:35
One thing most everyone agreed on was anyone representing 'America's Team' should exercise better judgment.


Quoted from this article...

cbs11tv.com . . .

I think it matters because of who she is and who she represents. My brother dressed as a black man one Halloween. Nobody cared because nobody cares who my brother is. (My mom and I raised our eyebrows.) This girl is in the public eye. The Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders are expected to maintain a high standard of behavior, in uniform or out. They sign a contract agreeing to such.

The Joker was not a member of an oppressed minority about to go to prison for possessing a weapon. Lil Wayne was arrested on multiple felony drug charges, but pled down to just the weapons charge. Someone an "America's Sweetheart" team member should dress as? Don't think so.

kk~
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By Brittanymember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Mon Nov 09, 2009 02:43 PM
I just think that is taking a light hearted holiday too seriously. Guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By kandykanePremium member
On Mon Nov 09, 2009 05:02 PM
^ It is a shame that Halloween is not as much fun as it used to be. :(
I was having that conversation with friends just recently.

kk~
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By Liritmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Mon Nov 09, 2009 07:12 PM
Edited by Lirit (28370) on 2009-11-09 19:41:29
Arak wrote:

Now, I was once told that blacks also had to wear blackface in order to appear onstage or in films during the Jim Crow era and up until about the 20's or 30's, but I can't find anything that actually says this is true. It was, however, extremely common before American attitudes toward racism began to change.


True, but not exactly accurate. It was illegal for black people to appear onstage for a white audience, pretty much full stop. That didn't stop, however, some troupes from hiring some of them, and to "get away with it", so to speak, they were painted in blackface. Think Bert Williams in the Ziegfield Follies, and you'll get a pretty good idea of what they did and how they did it.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween (karma: 1)
By Munkensteinmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Tue Nov 10, 2009 07:13 AM
I think it matters because of who she is and who she represents. My brother dressed as a black man one Halloween. Nobody cared because nobody cares who my brother is. (My mom and I raised our eyebrows.) This girl is in the public eye. The Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders are expected to maintain a high standard of behavior, in uniform or out. They sign a contract agreeing to such.

I'm with Brittany...nobody will agree on this. Some of us are old school and some are new school. I've been the majority and I've been the minority; I've been discriminated against for the color of my skin and nothing more. It's BS but I know that whining about it and trying to act like every little thing is racist won't help the situation.

This girl didn't mean anything negative and to me, it's a positive that she didn't get stopped in her tracks by thoughts of, "What if somebody is offended?" As I said before, this stuff won't be a big deal when people quit making it a big deal...we'll be past racism when it quits coming up. Sounds like she is past it, but others aren't...too bad for them.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By HarrisonSistersmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Tue Nov 10, 2009 03:36 PM
Racism is made by what we all say, nothing more nothing less.
i am white, but my niece is coloured and no matter what colour skin, we are all the same HUMAN.

Black people call white and white people call black, racism needs to be stop and this will never happen with post like this.

Clare
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By kandykanePremium member
On Tue Nov 10, 2009 03:45 PM
Edited by kandykane (157761) on 2009-11-10 15:46:28
I never said I was offended, personally, but I can certainly see how some people are.

And just because we don't talk about something doesn't mean it isn't there. I started first grade when my school was desegregated. Nobody talked to us kids about it because adults didn't talk to kids about stuff then. They just didn't. So, we had no idea what was happening. I felt something was amiss anyway. There was an undercurrent of anger. It was years later that I understood.

EDIT: Oh, and for the record, I have a biracial grand daughter.

kk~
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By Irishdancegrlmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Tue Nov 10, 2009 04:39 PM
When did anyone say LW was only offensive because it is a stereotype and Oprah wasn't? If I recall, the entire time I've been here I've been saying "Blackface is offensive because X." Not "LW is offensive because X." I have a problem with blackface, not the rapper. Go as Lil Wayne, go as Oprah, go as Obama, Condoleeza, Kanye, whatever. Just don't go in blackface.


and do tell how a person that wasn't black could depict those people? would people even have a clue who they were dressed up as?
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By Munkensteinmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Tue Nov 10, 2009 05:09 PM
And just because we don't talk about something doesn't mean it isn't there.

Hence why I previously said that we should use our energy when something actually IS racist instead of feeding into the frenzy that uptight people like to cause for no good reason.
re: This made national headlines: a girl dressed up in "blackface" for Halloween
By AinetheDragonPremium member
On Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:12 AM
Irishdancegrl wrote:



and do tell how a person that wasn't black could depict those people? would people even have a clue who they were dressed up as?


Thats pretty much my point... The whole purpose of a costume is to LOOK like the person you are dressed as, and it doesnt work if you dont look at all like them. I was thinking about going as Sookie Stackhouse for halloween... and I'd have to wear a blonde wig to pull it off. No one would get it if I wore short cutoff shorts and a t-shirt but left my hair/skin the way it is. People would look at me and go "why is Ann wearing such short shorts, and where is her costume?" not "hey, she's dressed as Sookie Stackhouse.... It works the same way with skin color, only people get more upset about that idea.

The costume was badly chosen, but I think people made a bigger deal out of it then it needed to be by calling it blackface. She was impersonating a known celebrity, and wore make-up to make herself look like him. I dont see that as any indication of racism, or any comment implied about race on her part. I think its more telling that other people took offense....
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