Forum: Twirling / Twirling

Judging comments on score sheets (for Judges, to respond please)
By twrl_dancemum
On Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:11 AM

As we are now just begining the New Twirling season, and have 2 competitions underway, I would like to encourage All Judges to PLEASE write comments on the Athletes score sheets!

Comments that would help and improve the content and construction of the routine.

We always have the same comments from various judges that do not really help the coach or athlete. The comments that I am refering to are the following....
Most of these comments a spectator could state.....and most are the obvious, as well....

- Smile more
- Twirl on toes
- stretch free hand
- keep knees and arms straight
- we always get checked on make up, costume, neatness, etc, always good
- fingers together

- ADD MORE, but Add What
- ADD more when ready, but again WHAT?

I feel that enough time, money is spent on the parent side to get that athlete in front of the Judge and the Judge is getting paid, so a little effort on the Judges part would be really great!

Costume, $$, door admission for the family $$ and entery fee for each event $$ lunch $$, Judge getting paid for the day $$
should really amount to something written on the Score Sheets!
Although the Judges pays are usually minimal but we are all there for the same thing to compete and do what the Athlete loves, B A T O N!

any comments would be great~ thanks

7 Replies to Judging comments on score sheets (for Judges, to respond please)

re: Judging comments on score sheets (for Judges, to respond please)
By TheAbbyTwirlsmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:28 AM
I'm not a judge, but I know everyone gets frustrated when a contest is going slow; therefore, some judges may be pressed for time to get things done and not take the time to write extra comments. . .
Just something to think about next time people are getting grumpy of a slow competition...

re: Judging comments on score sheets (for Judges, to respond please)
By TwirlSuperstar
On Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:46 AM
- Twirl on toes
- stretch free hand
- keep knees and arms straight

These are the most common mistakes that can make a difference from 1st to 3rd because the routine isn't polished yet. Twirlers need to be on the toes (releve) for better lines otherwise it looks sloppy. Same with the free hand and straightening. Too many kids take shortcuts and expect to win and they dont.

The Add more and add when ready is for the coach. The judge doesn't know what they do in practice or their skillset, the coach does. All a judge does is grade what is presented to them for those 1-2:30 minutes and make a judgment. I could say add a monster roll but if the athlete cant do a back neck, what would be the point? Also judges really cant offer routine construction advice since it can be viewed as poaching by coaches and have seen it happen by many judges.

In short, they are just to evaluate and thats it what is given to them. They dont have a list like skating does of what so and so can do.
re: Judging comments on score sheets (for Judges, to respond please)
By TwirlSportJunkie
On Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:56 PM
The questions you posed is for your COACH. Id be more upset at the coach for not adding what the judge felt like there is a deficiency in that routine.

Judges are highly trained in the sport, and is a objective yardstick to evaluate how your twirler is progressing. The judge lists comments generally for your twirler, and your coach. If there is something repetitive on the scoresheet, you can bet that area needs attention and needs to be fixed so they can progress in the growth and development. Sometimes parents get too wrapped up in whos placing 1st than the childs development.

re: Judging comments on score sheets (for Judges, to respond please)
By kmgmom
On Wed Feb 03, 2010 03:17 PM
As a mom, I always dislike those comments, they do not tell me what more needs added, especially when you already have a 6 turn in there!! As a judge, I feel that the money that was spent to enter is not just for the trophy but for the score sheet and I always try to be specific as to what section of the routine, or what the problem is specifically. Example - finger twirls-vertical finger twirls were off pattern, rolls had break after the fishtails. This way you know what section of the routine I was commenting on and where to look for corrections. I feel this is the responsibility of all judges to do. I do not like an empty score sheet either, unless the score is a 100!!!
re: Judging comments on score sheets (for Judges, to respond please)
By TheAbbyTwirlsmember has saluted, click to view salute photosPremium member
On Wed Feb 03, 2010 06:56 PM
I always like scoresheet where it has a list of different twirls that should be in a routine - vertical/horizontal twirls, fishtails, elbow rolls, spins, speed, etc. where te judge can check for very good, "X" it for needs improvement, or a 0 for not in the routine.

re: Judging comments on score sheets (for Judges, to respond please)
By CoachT
On Wed Feb 03, 2010 08:01 PM
I am a former twirler, mom of current twirler, coach of many twirlers, contest director and twirling

As a coach I want comments - more than circles and checks if there is something specific they can write that will guide me in the right direction. Give me something to go on - some sort of guide ---- However I do appreciate checks and circles...completely blank is what is annoying.

As a judge I have been instructed at local competitions and AYOP Nationals Judges Seminars NOT to write comments down......and I quote "we are there to judge what is presented, NOT there to give a free lesson".
BUT I do feel that comments can be helpful - especially if there is something that is really glaring at me about what is presented. Example....if they are not doing a correct thumb toss, not tossing from center.

As a mom I want to be able to have positives and negatives on the sheet so my daughter can see where she is doing a good job and where she needs to improve.

I can see how it can be frustrating to spend the time, money etc and feel as if you didn't get any constructive feedback. But have you taken your scoresheets and comparade them?

I like to take a couple competition sheets and lay them next to each other and see if the judges saw the same things.....example....

If looking at a solo score sheet don't look at the over all score...instead look at the caption COMPLETE that section to the next sheet. Are the same things checked and circled? Do that for each caption.

I also look at what was the highest caption on the sheet....and the lowest. The lowest would be a good place to start as far as where to improve your solo.

Hope that helps??
re: Judging comments on score sheets (for Judges, to respond please)
By chacha0349
On Wed Feb 03, 2010 09:18 PM
i should really waited to respond to this because I am tired. I have competed (1975-2003) Judged (1981-1994ish) and competed again 2006-now. Quite frankly I am in a better position to judge what I do and how I do it. With that said, every performance is different.

It is an anomoly to see the same basic routines. What is different is how it is done, which has been said here. When every beginning is basically doing two turn variations; fingers; fishtail variations; maybe 4 elbows; etc. it is little things that make difference; free hand, placement, posture, etc.

It is always a kunnumdrum to know what is most important. I do know this. I did not come back into competition to beat kids. With that said; i feel I am as entitled to my opinion as my competitors; and I am NEVER going to make a judge uncomfortable with questioning what they score. it is all subjective.

I operate off two turns. Sorry, I am resigned to the fact. Too fat, too much damage to the left leg/knee, never going to have a three.

I have a spot on section of fingers that I have been doing since 1978; thats 32 years now for those counting. I do it at NBTA flavored contsts. It is the bomb. I dont like it, but its required doing.

I can do rolls that I cant even tell you what they are; front necks closed and open and through mouth; to back necks; to angels but with a fishtail; usually before final turn doing 12-16 impecable continuous elbows for good measure.

I am so tired of being beat out by the girl with barely three elbows; barely two back neck; but 97 fishtails, but scratches out just barely maybe even caught with the right hand if lucky three turn.

But thats the breaks. its all subjective.

And I am not going to even start on a two baton routine, which I dont like, but again contains rolls i dont know how to describe.

So, really, at the end of the day, I would like to sometimes see the competitions scoresheet, because by the end of my routine i know my issues.

This doesnt help. I know what is frustrating is that parents that dont know twirling cant sometimes see the finer details, no matter how hard they look.

You gain insight when you see yourself on camera, especially like nationals when you can get all the performances and compare them side to side.

Not an easy thing.

I hope kids will continue to twirl.

I mean, Miss America told us, before winning, to getoutside and play with a stick. And thats what we do.



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